Now with creativename's 2004 Xsts!

*Stats websites*

Everything you could ever imagine:
http://www.sc2k4.com

Sortable Table for Every Contest Match:
http://sc2k4.com/displaytable.php

Explanation of Extrapolated Standings:
http://sc2k4.com/extrapolated.php

Simple Explanation of Extrapolated Standings:
A = Strongest Character
B = Character Weaker than A
C = Character Weaker than B
To figure out a character's Xsts Percentage ---> [(CvB)(BvA)]/50 = CvA
To compare how C would do against B ---> [(CvA)/(BvA)]*50 = CvB
To figure out how B would do against A ---> [(CvA)/(CvB)]*50 = BvA

Summer 2002 Extrapolated Standings:
http://sc2k4.com/excel/sc2k2_extrapolated.htm

Summer 2003 Extrapolated Standings:
http://sc2k4.com/excel/sc2k3_extrapolated.htm

Character comparisons Between Summer 2002 and Summer 2003:
http://sc2k4.com/summer_comparisons.php

Spring 2004 Extrapolated Standings:
http://sc2k4.com/excel/spc2k4_extrapolated.htm

SFF Adjusted Spring 2004 Extrapolated Standings:
http://sc2k4.com/excel/spc2k4_extrapolated_sff.htm

Summer 2004 Extrapolated Standings:
http://sc2k4.com/excel/sc2k4_extrapolated.htm

SFF Adjusted 2004 Extrapolated Standings:
http://sc2k4.com/excel/sc2k4_extrapolated_sff.htm

Summer 2002 Contest:
http://solarshadow2002.tripod.com

Summer 2003 Contest:
http://solarshadow-stats.tripod.com/2003/index.html

Spring 2004 Contest: (not currently updating)
http://solarshadow-stats.tripod.com/sp2004/index.html

*Stats topics*

Summer 2002 Contest:
http://solarshadow2002.tripod.com/page1.html

Summer 2003 Contest:
http://solarshadow-stats.tripod.com/archive/topic1p1.html
http://www.angelfire.com/games5/sum_contest/Page1.htm (See note)

2003-2004 Off-Season:
http://membres.lycos.fr/shindohikaru/stats1.htm (See note)
Note: Don't use the links in the topic to browse through the pages, change the page number in the URL.

Spring 2004 Pre-Season:
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringPreSeason1.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringPreSeason2.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringPreSeason3.htm

Spring 2004 Contest:
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats1.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats2.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats3.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats4.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats5.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats6.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats7.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats8.htm

Creativename's Links Page:
http://sc2k4.com/links.php

*Miscellaneous*

MMXcalibur's Prophet Sites:
http://prophetchallenge.hyperboards2.com/index.cgi
http://www.freewebs.com/mmxcalibur/

Poll Vote Total Updator:
http://sc2k4.com/update.php (add "?pollid=[4-digit poll number]" at the end of url to look at charts from past polls)

Summer 2002 Match Pictures:
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=15
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=15&page=1
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=15&page=2

Summer 2003 Match Pictures:
www.angelfire.com/games5/heroicmario0/contestpictures.htm

Spring 2004 Match Pictures:
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=17
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=17&page=1
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=17&page=2
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=17&page=3

Summer 2004 Match Pictures:
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=18
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=18&page=1
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=18&page=2
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=18&page=3

!yawA tsoP
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I am little more than a slug among the food chain that is Board 8, but perhaps if I were as cool as nifboy, that would not be the case. Congrats, nifboy! =)

tag
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*nifboy-ps2rulezzz-A Hogasm IN POG FORM*
They are my Gurus. They are my Gods.

*pokes with stick*
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Not hittin' 100 before '05 my ass. We are still crankin' out about one every 1.5 days, and with some master(mage19)ful discussion to boot. Some of you (RP)Guy(96)s think it will slow(flake), but there is no doubt we shall be creative(name) enough to make certain part 100 (ulti)materialize(rx)s before we party like its 1999.
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nifboy kicked ass and took names, including my own in SC2k4

Not hittin' 100 before '05 my ass. We are still crankin' out about one every 1.5 days, and with some master(mage19)ful discussion to boot. Some of you (RP)Guy(96)s think it will slow(flake), but there is no doubt we shall be creative(name) enough to make certain part 100 (ulti)materialize(rx)s before we party like its 1999.

Y(tnote)ou are so crazy. ^_^
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I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

But yeah, I think these topics will fill up fast for a good while. Maybe slow a bit but... unless that idea where we make the bracket actually happens. Then we won't be spending all our time in this topic.
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I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

We'll need this real soon...
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Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

That we will
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I am little more than a slug among the food chain that is Board 8, but perhaps if I were as cool as nifboy, that would not be the case. Congrats, nifboy! =)

When do you think we'll hear a response from CJayC, Ulti?
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My bracket is still crying over Nifboy's owning in the Guru contest.
"I do read sometimes." Mat Cauthon, The Wheel of Time.

(i would think after today's poll closes, but whatever.)

Anyway, these topics are flowing, but after a week or 2, they'll slow down. i think.
<_<
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"I AM THE BLACK MAGE! I CASTS THE MAGIC SPELLS THAT MAKES THE PEOPLES FALL DOWN!" RPGE777:ChocoCid

So, is Magus classed on the Nobel Nine now?
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Ahem! There's LETTUCE on my boots!
http://www.geocities.com/lettucekefka/

He was last year as well as this year.
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Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

[This message was deleted at the request of a moderator or administrator]

Maybe all of these contest related polls have something to do with the list that ‘‘Ulti’’ sent to CJayC.
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I know it may seem so, but I'm not angry, and I'm not mad at you. XD

I think CJayC would have made these polls regardless. He makes a "Should there be another contest?" poll after every contest, and I think that the "Should the winners be taken out?" poll is because CJayC was as dissatisfied with how the bracket turned out as we were.
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I am little more than a slug among the food chain that is Board 8, but perhaps if I were as cool as nifboy, that would not be the case. Congrats, nifboy! =)

Back to the topic of taking Clink out: Why do it when you can set this up?

(1) Link
(2) Cloud

(1) Sephiroth
(2) Samus

(1) Crono
(2) Mega Man
(3) Ryu
(6) Ganondorf

(1) Mario
(2) Sonic
(3) Master Chief
(4) Solid Snake
(5) Zero
(6) Magus

Matter of fact, I'm going to start working on my bracket.
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"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Oh, and HM, my Protoman adjustment was based on 7.5% SFF against Zero, which was, of course, completely estimated. Chances are he'll fall somewhere between CN's value and my value next year.
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"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Once again, I'll state that removing Link and Cloud solves nothing. You're still not going to get any exciting 1-16, 1-8/9, or 1-4/5 matches without them in there without some outlandish over/underseeding, and the character contest hasn't been THAT bad with seeding.

As others have suggested (though I don't necessarily agree with it, but it's a good compromise), set up Link and Cloud in the same division. Removing them doesn't make the winner any less predictable. It just makes the margin that he/she wins by smaller.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

"He was last year as well as this year."

Last year everyone classed Sonic ahead of him.
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Ahem! There's LETTUCE on my boots!
http://www.geocities.com/lettucekefka/

It's hard to really classify Magus as Noble Nine anyway since we're only estimating him by his 2003 numbers. For all we know, he had an increase similar to Crono's.

Also, how in the world did Vivi end up below Tidus in the extrapolateds? I never would've guessed that would happen.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Oh, and HM, my Protoman adjustment was based on 7.5% SFF against Zero

Am I the only one that thinks there's a contradiction in claiming that there was no SFF in Mega Man-Zero, yet there was SFF in Zero-Protoman? IMO, if there was, it was minimal.
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Jon Thomson - nifboy > me
Nominate Ridley for Summer Contest 2005

I adjusted for SFF in Mega Man/Zero before I applied 20XXDF. Without 20XXDF, there was about 3%, I think, without it there was actually -.87% (rSFF). And I don't think it's a contradiction at all: We say there's no SFF in Cloud/Seph but are quick to adjust Cloud/Squall, despite the fact that they both did worse than expected.
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"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Oh, and HM, my Protoman adjustment was based on 7.5% SFF against Zero, which was, of course, completely estimated. Chances are he'll fall somewhere between CN's value and my value next year.

I actually liked where you had put him at, myself. Although, I think CN's is far, far to low.
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Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Well, Mega Man and Zero are the two most popular in the series. As much as I hate to say it, Protoman faded out of the limelight quite a while ago, probably around the time that Bass was introduced.

Give me a new Mega Man game with Protoman as a playable character, and I will be a happy man.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

No SFF against Proto Man? Well he's damn weak enough to join Ratchet and his PS2 crew.

We say there's no reason to adjust SFF in Cloud-Sephiroth because there wasn't any sign of it in their match last year, and we were able to accurately predict the percentage through Sephiroth's matches with Vivi and Auron this year.

However, even IF Squall dropped, he still doesn't lose THAT badly.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

For anybody interested in looking at my stats, ExThaNemesis was kind enough to throw them up here:

www.lostfate.com/exthanemesis/SC2k4XS.xls

Major thanks to ExThaNemesis. :)
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"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Give me a new Mega Man game with Protoman as a playable character, and I will be a happy man.

Mega Man Battle Network 5 Proto Man Army Version.

I don't want to be part of the list. I feel that I can work with what is given to me, and with all the gurus on the list, I have an awesome shot at winning now. Especially if I don't listen to the board. The two matches I missed this summer were due to board hype (Frog vs Solid and Joe vs Tails). My original bracket was perfect. Board hype almost made me change Tidus, Ness, and Sora over Ryu Hayabusa.

So anyway, count me out. I'm sure that your brackets will be hellish, and I am sure that I will win the next contest.

~ SD
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SpC2k4: 162/192 ~ SC2k4: 187/192
A tribute to Glenn's eternal victories.

Am I the only one that thinks there's a contradiction in claiming that there was no SFF in Mega Man-Zero, yet there was SFF in Zero-Protoman? IMO, if there was, it was minimal.

Actually, it makes perfect sense. It looks to me like the X series will get SFF in any Mega Man Series vs Mega Man X Series poll.
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Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

Also what's this talk of removing Sephiroth with Link and Cloud? Technically he's never won, so we can't say anything.
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SpC2k4: 162/192 ~ SC2k4: 187/192
A tribute to Glenn's eternal victories.

Also what's this talk of removing Sephiroth with Link and Cloud? Technically he's never won, so we can't say anything.

What would be more exciting? Guessing who is going to win out of Cloud and Link or watching an unchallenged Sephiroth win?
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~Blade X~

Well, if you remove Sephiroth, then Samus probably takes it without much of a challenge. Based on the rankings this year, the only one who would even pose a threat to her is Crono.

Now guess which one of them has some huge releases due out before the next contest.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

I meant Classic Mega Man with Protoman as a playable character. I'm not a big fan of the Battle Network games.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

What would be more exciting? Guessing who is going to win out of Cloud and Link or watching an unchallenged Sephiroth win?

... because Ceej doesn't have a legit excuse to remove Sephiroth. He's lost in the finals, semi-finals, and quarter-finals. He's never come within 3000 votes of beating the champ.
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SpC2k4: 162/192 ~ SC2k4: 187/192
A tribute to Glenn's eternal victories.

Well then what's even the point of removing Link or Cloud? We're just going to keep going on down the list of extrapolated ratings, the contest will always be predictable.
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~Blade X~

Exactly. Nobody seems to understand that though. I guess people would rather keep their winners predictable, but not dominant.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Well then what's even the point of removing Link or Cloud? We're just going to keep going on down the list of extrapolated ratings, the contest will always be predictable.

My point exactly. That's why we SHOULD keep Link and Cloud, or have no contest at all.
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SpC2k4: 162/192 ~ SC2k4: 187/192
A tribute to Glenn's eternal victories.

Yeah, unfortunately if Ceej listens to his polls it looks like we'll be seeing a pointless contest next year, woohoo! -_-;
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~Blade X~

RPGuy - A possible reason that Frog/MC/LSnake/Crash appear to be too strong when adjusting Mega Man too much could be the Solid **** factor. Would adjusting them to fit Crash 2k3 after the Mega Man adjustment make them look more reasonable?
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Although being raped by Sora twice was incredibly painful, nothing can compare to being utterly destroyed by nifboy in the Guru challenge.

I fully agree that taking out Link and Cloud is the most ridiculous thing to do. All it does is bump everyone's current relative standings up two, retain the same predictiabilty, and allow Seph or Samus to win.

The predictability of this contest had NOTHING to do with Link and Cloud. They only participate in a total of 9 matches... The rest of the matches can be hell to choose and we still have a great contest.
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I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

No and Yes are almost even. Then if you include the "Maybe but THAT WON'T HELP" option, No is really winning.
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I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

The whole point of removing Cloud and Link is to have a more unpredictable bracket with an unpredictable winner right? Well, by removing those two Samus/Sephiroth step right up and take their place. That's right, you still have two characters to choose from for a winner. Woohoo!

Just by sticking Link and Cloud in the same division you create a bracket with four divisions that don't have a clear-cut winner. Yes, one of the winners will still be Link/Cloud but with Advent Children coming out picking a winner there is as hard as ever. With a solution like that there is only two reasons I could see for people to still want them out: 1. A new winner; 2. They just don't like Link/Cloud.
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Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Again I must say... Listen to The Man.
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SpC2k4: 162/192 ~ SC2k4: 187/192
A tribute to Glenn's eternal victories.

The whole point of removing Cloud and Link is to have a more unpredictable bracket with an unpredictable winner right? Well, by removing those two Samus/Sephiroth step right up and take their place. That's right, you still have two characters to choose from for a winner. Woohoo!

Took the words right out of my mouth. Taking out Link/Cloud is pointless. Those two powerhouses step down, Samus and Seph move up. Then they would probably be retired and Crono/Mario/Mega and then the cycle continues until we are left with weak characters.
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Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Moltar Fact 12. Moltar would have made the leaderboard if he didn’t have Cloud winning.

Just by sticking Link and Cloud in the same division you create a bracket with four divisions that don't have a clear-cut winner. Yes, one of the winners will still be Link/Cloud but with Advent Children coming out picking a winner there is as hard as ever. With a solution like that there is only two reasons I could see for people to still want them out: 1. A new winner; 2. They just don't like Link/Cloud.

Heroic Mario just hit the nail so hard on the head it went through my foot... You know what I mean...
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I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Yeah because it's what we just said :P
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~Blade X~

Link and Cloud really shouldn't be taken out, imo.

And, what happens if there is no adjustment made for Link/Megaman. Personally, I don't think there was sff, I would rather believe that Megaman abused the karma system of the world in slaughtering Tidus and had to pay back his debt. I mean, why coulndn't Sonic have increased? Why is it so hard to see Sonic over Megaman? It sounds illogical, but maybe thats just because of how he did last year against Cloud, which admittedly, was not very impressive to say the least.
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Congratulations to nifboy, ps2rulezzz, and Hogasm, who won the guru challenge through their godly prediction abilities. : )

Personally, I don't think there was sff

I don't either, but his spot in the X-sts is perfect.
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Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

I don't think there was any SFF either I just think his fanbase was taken away when he went up against a way more popular mainstream character.
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~Blade X~

Why is it so hard to see Sonic over Megaman? It sounds illogical, but maybe thats just because of how he did last year against Cloud, which admittedly, was not very impressive to say the least.

Hey I'd love nothing more than Sonic being the top ranked character in this contest overall, let alone being over Mega Man. This isn't why I think there was SFF though. Mega Man doesn't usually fall apart against top-tier characters. Link has a perfectly good reason to have that effect. Mega Man's fanbase is more or less Nintendo driven.
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I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

I don't agree with taking Clink out or stacking one division with both of them.

If you take them out, we just have to bump everybody else and we still know who the finalists will be.

If you stick them in one division, we'll have an anti-climactic semifinals and final, with one of them slaughtering whoever is left on his path.

IMO, both of those suggestions are bad ideas, we need both of them to stay as vote drawers and we need a climactic final between the two of them.

If you want unpredictability, doing something new is the ONLY way to go.

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<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

I'm still floored by Mega Man's performance against Link. Just so terrible... ;_;
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Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

The predictability of this contest had NOTHING to do with Link and Cloud. They only participate in a total of 9 matches... The rest of the matches can be hell to choose and we still have a great contest.

Nothing to do with Cloud and Link my ass. 9 matches is fifteen percent of the contest. Yeah, we could have a good contest if we left them in, but we can have a BETTER contest if we take them the hell out.

Just by sticking Link and Cloud in the same division you create a bracket with four divisions that don't have a clear-cut winner.

Look at their prediction percentages. With what they have lined up for this year, you can't honestly tell me that the winner of Cloud v. Link wouldnt easily, and boringly, win the contest. Even if they are a one and two seed in the same division, thats still eight horribly one sided matches involving Clink, and only one interesting match. 8 Crap matchers vs. 1 Good match is nonsensical.

Yes, if you take them out, the winner next year will probably be Sephimus. But if you don't take them out, the winner WILL be Clink. Sephimus at least has its challengers - some people are close to them in the stats, and could still potentially take either of them down. But Clink isnt defeatable at this point.

Yes, people said the same thing of Link after the 2002 Contest, but the only reason Cloud even challenged him is becasue of the huge Demographic change at Gfaqs. That won't happen a second time.

Then they would probably be retired and Crono/Mario/Mega and then the cycle continues until we are left with weak characters.

Ok, Magus isnt going to get around to winning the tournament till when, 2011? Unless you think that there will be NO memorable characters created ever again, this argument is idiotic. New characters will arise - hell, even Cloud is only, what, eight years old? Saying that we'll have a weak tournament in the year 20XX relies on the fact that no good characters will ever be added. Which is, you know, stupid.
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nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

Sephiroth and Samus would blow out everyone the faced about the same way Cloud and Link would.
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I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Megaman indeed seems to appeal to the same people who like Nintendo. The only Nintendo characters Megaman ever faced before were Resetti and Zelda. Not exactly SFF prospects there. But someone with the mass appeal of Link? I'm not sure on this. But something, anything, HAD to happen.

And HM put up the best argument EVER in that whole retiring debate. Many said the same thing before, but the wording there was perfect. CJayC should be made aware of this.

I'm also under the impression that AC could do greater things for Sephiroth than Echoes and Hunters could do for Samus. Add some possible SFF in Cloud/Seph (he lost four points between years after all) and I don't see Sephiroth losing in case of retirements, although a decent case could be made for Samus.

But why do I even care, I'll be gone if Link and Cloud are retired.
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Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

If you stick them in one division, we'll have an anti-climactic semifinals and final, with one of them slaughtering whoever is left on his path.

You get one bad final four match and a final that isn't even from end to end--not like we've ever had won anyway. You'll notice we had two bad final four matches this year and a good final match. There is nothing wrong with sticking them in the same division. It contains their dominance over the rest of the crowd and still is a critical match to predict.
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Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Why would a movie that only appeals to the FFVII fanboys help a character more than a system's number one title for the holidays AND a pack-in demo which will be played by several millions.

If you stick them in one division, we'll have an anti-climactic semifinals and final, with one of them slaughtering whoever is left on his path.

Exactly. Remember FF7/OoT? We didn't even get a close match there, and we KNEW 46% was the closest anything would ever come to FF7. From a championship perspective, SSBM and CT had virtually no interest.
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Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

What I think would be interesting is to have a 3-way poll between Cloud, Sephiroth, and Link at the beginning of the next contest. Then, proceed as normal.
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My luck works best when things are... random. Mat Cauthon from The Dragon Reborn

9 matches is fifteen percent of the contest. Yeah, we could have a good contest if we left them in, but we can have a BETTER contest if we take them out.

How exactly do you make these 9 matches better? The only thing you'll change is making those wins less dominant.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

I think the only SOMEWHAT legitimate argument against Cloud and Link in the same bracket is that it makes their match worth more than it should be. But unless we were allowed to make the bracket next year and created an absolute suicide inducer, you would never win at -32 anyway.
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I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

that only appeals to the FFVII fanboys

That's my bone with the Samus For Champion argument. The same could've been said for KH, as it relied a LOT on these cameos to sell (quadruple platinum BTW) in the first place. But look at the impact... the competition's been devastated, to the sole exception of Link, who still lost.
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Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

What I think would be interesting is to have a 3-way poll between Cloud, Sephiroth, and Link at the beginning of the next contest. Then, proceed as normal.

Say it with me. Ess. Eff. Eff. Link would rape them both.
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Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

Advent Children doesn't have to bring in new fans at all. It just needs to bring to remembrance the things that we loved about the game, such as the ultimate end-all, be-all final battle between Cloud and Sephiroth. Plus, the recency of it keeps it fresh in people's minds. The further away you get from it, the less significant or special it seems.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Look at their prediction percentages. With what they have lined up for this year, you can't honestly tell me that the winner of Cloud v. Link wouldnt easily, and boringly, win the contest.

Duh. I said that, you get one bad final four match and one lesser finals match--depending on opponent. You either keep their dominance contained or let them unleash it across two separate divisions. Do you know what that creates? Only two divisions that remain unpredictable.

Even if they are a one and two seed in the same division, thats still eight horribly one sided matches involving Clink, and only one interesting match. 8 Crap matchers vs. 1 Good match is nonsensical.

There will never be a good match involving Link/Cloud unless they are facing each other. Never. Outside of round 1/2 that entire division would be nothing more than Link and Cloud tearing everyone up, but it's not like we'd lose any "elites" and it certainly wouldn't be any different than the Midgar Division this year. Imagine the Midgar Division this year WITHOUT those awful SFF matchups. I don't see a problem with that as opposed to taking them out or allowing them to destroy two divisions.

Yes, if you take them out, the winner next year will probably be Sephimus. But if you don't take them out, the winner WILL be Clink.

The winner WILL be Sephiroth/Samus whether you would disagree or not. Sephiroth has Advent Children coming out and Samus has Metroid Prime 2: Echoes and Metroid Prime Hunters: First Hunt. That means those two will be boosting even higher with this coming year. Sephiroth, who is already projected to win with ~54%, would be stronger next year. Yes, the dominance would be closer with Sephimus as opposed to Clink but the winner remains just as, if not less, predictable than before.

Sephimus at least has its challengers - some people are close to them in the stats, and could still potentially take either of them down. But Clink isnt defeatable at this point.

Neither would Sephimus next year. All you get is less dominance, but still a clear-cut winner on the matter.


---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

I guess you're right. Just trying to think of ways to keep the contest unpredictable.
---
My luck works best when things are... random. Mat Cauthon from The Dragon Reborn

You get one bad final four match and a final that isn't even from end to end--not like we've ever had won anyway. You'll notice we had two bad final four matches this year and a good final match.

A good final >>> a good semi.

A good final + 2 bad semi >>> a good semi + a bad semi + a bad final.

There is nothing wrong with sticking them in the same division. It contains their dominance over the rest of the crowd and still is a critical match to predict.

And the top scorers who predict that match correctly can start writing their wish list, while the rest of us wait in total boredom for the contest to be over with.

---
<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

Cloud and Link in the same bracket is fine. Hell, I'll be fine if they're on OPPOSITE ends of the bracket. As long as every match leading up to it is good.
---
SpC2k4: 162/192 ~ SC2k4: 187/192
A tribute to Glenn's eternal victories.

I'm still floored by Mega Man's performance against Link. Just so terrible...

Which reminds me of some more points.

Link is now at the point where he is getting SFF on freaking MegaMan. Cloud gets SFF on damn near any Square character he wants. Having Clink capable of SFF'ing 70 percent of the tournament means we never get to see the actually strength of a lot of characters. In my guarded opinion, this blows. This isnt a reason to get rid of them in of itself, but at the point where retiring them will also make the contest a lot more worthwhile and unpredictable, then I feel its time to sack them.

If we're keeping company limits, Link and Cloud are always going to keep strong characters from getting in. If we want to see more than just a little bit of change in this contest, then getting rid of the untouchables would be the first place we would want to go.

Also, as to the "OMG SEPHIMUS MEGARONO WILL BE OBVIOUS WINNARS!!1!!" type complaint - so? Yes, the contest powerhouses will still be fairly predictable. But as it stands, its ridiculously predictable. If we take out the most egregious offenders, then we can still maintain a high draw while actually having a contest where half the matches are obvious to anyone who is capable of dressing themselves in the morning.

Yeah, Clink draws more, but realistically - how many of those are probably multi votes? I don't see their absence being a crippling blow to the draw of the tournament, and in allowing for new entries to show themselves, the tournament suddenly becomes interesting to whole new groups of people.
---
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

I would like to see Mario make it to the final four.
---
My luck works best when things are... random. Mat Cauthon from The Dragon Reborn

Yes, the contest powerhouses will still be fairly predictable. But as it stands, its ridiculously predictable.

Okay, so you agree that the contest is still predictable even without them. So why do you want to remove the two biggest draws?
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Oh yeah, it would be more predictable without Cloud and Link actually... A lot of people busted their bracket on Sephiroth/Cloud. It seemed obvious to the majority of US but not normal bracket-makers.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

How exactly do you make these 9 matches better?

More new blood, fewer unstoppable forces. Glad to answer your question.
---
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

A good final >>> a good semi.

Yes, you would get a good repeat final and two terrible semi-final matches.

A good final + 2 bad semi >>> a good semi + a bad semi + a bad final.<

You actually get two good semi-final matches, four great elite eight matches, one bad semi-final match, and a not so great final match.

And the top scorers who predict that match correctly can start writing their wish list, while the rest of us wait in total boredom for the contest to be over with.

The two final four matches were about as boring as they come. One complete domination and one domination to show that Cloud wasn't going to win against Link. It would utterly shock me to see us get to the finals not know exactly who was going to win based off previous matches.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Nothing to do with Cloud and Link my ass. 9 matches is fifteen percent of the contest.

Woah, woah, WOAH! You're complaining about the fact that less than one in six matches involve Cloud or Link, with one of those matches being between the two of them?

8 Crap matchers vs. 1 Good match is nonsensical.

Sorry, I don't know how to say "there's three other, completely unpredicatable divisions" in Moronese.

Yes, if you take them out, the winner next year will probably be Sephimus. But if you don't take them out, the winner WILL be Clink.

And by removing Clink, we're accomplishing...what? Lowering vote totals?

But Clink isnt defeatable at this point.

New characters will arise - hell, even Cloud is only, what, eight years old?

Blatant hypocrisy there.

Yes, people said the same thing of Link after the 2002 Contest, but the only reason Cloud even challenged him is becasue of the huge Demographic change at Gfaqs. That won't happen a second time.

Man, it's great that you live in 2005, or else we all might think that you're pulling facts out of your ass.

Saying that we'll have a weak tournament in the year 20XX relies on the fact that no good characters will ever be added. Which is, you know, stupid.

Saying that we'll have a boring tournament as long as Link and Cloud are in it relies on the fact that no good characters will ever be added. Which is, you know, stupid.
---
"Thank you, Mario. But our princess is in another castle."
-Toad in Super Mario Bros.

I would like to see Mario make it to the final four.

*waves the "he already has" flag*
---
"Thank you, Mario. But our princess is in another castle."
-Toad in Super Mario Bros.

More new blood, fewer unstoppable forces.

Yes, because new blood is guaranteed to result in good matches. Not everyone is going to be a Frog or Liquid Snake. The majority will be an HK-47.

You don't get fewer unstoppable forces. You just have less amplified ones.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

More new blood, fewer unstoppable forces. Glad to answer your question.

The reason Ceej runs this contest in the first place, is to draw people's attention to this site.

And unfortunately, it's those "unstoppable forces" that has the power to draw people's attention.

A contest without Sephirmus Clink will be one that the casuals are happy to ignore.

---
<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

If we're keeping company limits, Link and Cloud are always going to keep strong characters from getting in.

No joke. That might be because they are the two strongest characters in this contest and thus warrant those getting snubbed to wait. I don't see what the problem would be with that.

If we want to see more than just a little bit of change in this contest, then getting rid of the untouchables would be the first place we would want to go.

There's no sense in removing Link and Cloud just to have two more characters step up to the plate and take their spot. That's just so much better. You get a new winner, but have it just as predictable as it was before.

Yes, the contest powerhouses will still be fairly predictable. But as it stands, its ridiculously predictable.

Thank you. You can agree that no matter what action we take the winner of this contest will remain predictable. So, now what's the point of removing Link/Cloud again?

and in allowing for new entries to show themselves, the tournament suddenly becomes interesting to whole new groups of people.

You can allow new entries into the contest without having to remove Cloud or Link. You can also create a very unpredictable bracket--overall--without removing them.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

and in allowing for new entries to show themselves, the tournament suddenly becomes interesting to whole new groups of people.

And just as many people will stop caring...
---
Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

It isn't hard to think of 64 quality characters while counting Cloud and Link ANYWAY. Tanner and Guybrush are better examples of characters holding back better characters from being in.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

More new blood, fewer unstoppable forces. Glad to answer your question.

You have the same number of unstoppable forces and new characters that could very well prove to be fodder.
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Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

[This message was deleted at the request of a moderator or administrator]

You actually get two good semi-final matches, four great elite eight matches, one bad semi-final match, and a not so great final match.

You know that there's only TWO semi-finals, don't you?

And one of them (winner of Clink vs. fodder) is guaranteed to be bad.

The two final four matches were about as boring as they come. One complete domination and one domination to show that Cloud wasn't going to win against Link. It would utterly shock me to see us get to the finals not know exactly who was going to win based off previous matches.

At least by delaying Cloud vs. Link, we can have a climactic final.

Imagine a Link vs. Sephiroth/Samus final, do you think anyone is going to watch it?

I, for one, isn't going to care less.

---
<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

They are a mildly above average draw on days when they hit random fodder

Funny that you should say that, because at one point the top vote-getting matches looked like that:

1. Cloud vs. Pikachu
2. Cloud vs. Alucard
3. Cloud vs. Fox

And that was 50 matches into the first contest, too.
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Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

You know that there's only TWO semi-finals, don't you?

I was thinking of something else, for some reason.

At least by delaying Cloud vs. Link, we can have a climactic final.

There was only one part of the finals match this year that was remotely exciting. When Cloud started coming back early in the morning. Aside from that point, Link was clearly in control of this match from the start.

---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

It doesn't benefit CJayC at all to take out Cloud or Link. It also doesn't benefit any of their fans (aka 100% of the people who visit this site).
---
SpC2k4: 162/192 ~ SC2k4: 187/192
A tribute to Glenn's eternal victories.

You have the same number of unstoppable forces and new characters that could very well prove to be fodder.

As it stands, no one can beat Clink. No one other than them could beat Sephimus. Which means that, technically speaking, those four could run right on through to division championships with nary a problem. By getting rid of two of them, suddenly two divisions are open for actual competition. For those of you who are unable of putting 2 and 2 together and getting 4, this means that there are fewer unstoppable forces. Natch.

Yeah, we shouldnt have characters like Guybrush and Tanner. I'm the first to admit that. But there are still a ton of probably strong characters out there who DIDNT get into the contest. If Link and Cloud each draw a nomination from half the freaking population of gamefaqs, that means that a lot of actually worthy characters will never get nominated, and small little cults can continue to get their uber-crap characters into these contests.
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nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

We should probably just get rid of the standard (note: only standard) character contest for good...or...

If we got rid of ANYBODY, I believe we should get rid of those that has ever made the Final 4. That leaves Solid Snake and Sonic, the only two original characters of the Noble Nine that could be challenged by several other characters such as Aeris, Magus, Master Chief, Ganondorf, and Zero. If that's not unpredictable, I don't know what is.

---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think."

But can you think of one that has both the potential of being climactic and one that would generate interest?

I can only think of Link/Cloud, personally.
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Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

What taking Clink out would accomplish is making the contest interesting again

This contest is just as interesting with or without them. Some of the best matches in this contest have involved characters who had no chance of winning the contest (Frog vs. Liquid Snake/Master Chief, Final Fantasy Tactics-Metal Gear Solid). It's a rare occasion when a member of the Noble Nine has a good match, and most of them occurred in 2002. None of them happened this year.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Funny that you should say that, because at one point the top vote-getting matches looked like that:

1. Cloud vs. Pikachu
2. Cloud vs. Alucard
3. Cloud vs. Fox

And that was 50 matches into the first contest, too

To clarify - those matchs are at the top. Duh. However, its not as if Cloud himself makes a match draw 100000 more votes than it otherwise would have. In the overall terms of the contest, even though they are the higher scoring matches, its not as if no other characters are capable of drawing votes either.
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nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

As it stands, no one can beat Clink.

Correct. You take those two out and no one can beat Sephiroth or Samus.

No one other than them could beat Sephimus. Which means that, technically speaking, those four could run right on through to division championships with nary a problem.

If you give those four #1 seeds then yes, but if you stick Cloud/Link and Samus/Sephiroth two separate divisions--Link/Cloud in the North; Samus/Sephiroth in any other--you get four totally unpredictable divisions.

---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Aside from that point, Link was clearly in control of this match from the start.

No, Link was not. He never broke away from Cloud until late in the morning.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

You know that there's only TWO semi-finals, don't you?

And one of them (winner of Clink vs. fodder) is guaranteed to be bad.

One of them is actually gonna be Cloud/Link vs Sephiroth/Samus. The other is gonna be Mega Man/Crono vs Mario/Sonic.

---
SpC2k4: 162/192 ~ SC2k4: 187/192
A tribute to Glenn's eternal victories.

Some of the best matches in this contest have involved characters who had no chance of winning the contest (Frog vs. Liquid Snake/Master Chief, Final Fantasy Tactics-Metal Gear Solid). It's a rare occasion when a member of the Noble Nine has a good match, and most of them occurred in 2002.

By having Clink in the contest, they are taking up a huge number of matches that otherwise COULD be close, interesting matches. Nothing with Clink that isnt Cloud v. Link will be remotely close. They'll continue to waste ten or so matches a contest until they leave.
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nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

But can you think of one that has both the potential of being climactic and one that would generate interest?

I can only think of Link/Cloud, personally.

DITTO, Snowflake hit the nail on the head.

Nothing else can replace the atmosphere of a final between those two.

We ALL know who the winner will be by then, but NOT the general masses.

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<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

By having Clink in the contest, they are taking up a huge number of matches that otherwise COULD be close, interesting matches.

Yes, because replacing Link and Cloud would definitely start giving us interesting 1-16, 1-8/9, and 1-4/5 matches.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

No, Link was not. He never broke away from Cloud until late in the morning.

It wasn't the most exciting thing in the world until Cloud started coming back on Cloud. When I woke up at 9:00 AM (central), that match was all said and done. Much like in 2003 when Cloud did nothing but take control of the majority of the match. It would be surprising to see a match between them that was like ALttP/CT. Although, I would love to see something as great as that.
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Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Nothing else can replace the atmosphere of a final between those two.

Of course, no matter where they are at it is the greatest match to see in a contest. Having that gone would just be terrible. I don't see how someone couldn't look forward to a match between the two.

---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

We ALL know who the winner will be by then

I beg to differ. Had Link not treated Megaman like a virgin on prom night, we would've had no idea who was going to win this year. With Zelda 10 and AC, it's going to be yet another different ball game. I have no ****ing idea who I'd pick between the two.
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Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

One of them is actually gonna be Cloud/Link vs Sephiroth/Samus.

If it was done this year, it would be Link vs. Sephy.

And as strong as Sephy is compared to most elites, he's fodder for Link (or Cloud).

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<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

Correct. You take those two out and no one can beat Sephiroth or Samus.

Which is.....wow, my next sentence after that! What a coincidence.

Oh, wait. Not.

If you give those four #1 seeds then yes, but if you stick Cloud/Link and Samus/Sephiroth two separate divisions--Link/Cloud in the North; Samus/Sephiroth in any other--you get four totally unpredictable divisions.

That solution would be better than what we have now, admittingly. But taking out Clink would be better. Those four would each dominate their half divisions, no questions asked. With two of them missing, then suddenly there are two extra seats in the elite eight. Hm, I think I'd prefer that.

Also, sticking Cloud v. Link and Samus v. Sephy in the same divisions? Why not just stick them all at 1,2,8,9 seeds in North and clear up as much room as possible?

Oh yeah. Because that would suck. ANTICLIMACTIC'D/10
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nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

Augh! The topic is moving faster than i can respond to things!
---
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

I beg to differ. Had Link not treated Megaman like a virgin on prom night, we would've had no idea who was going to win this year.

You see, unless they perform equally up until that point we know exactly who is favored to win and by how much. They would have to have equally as impressive performances against their respective opponents to make even us scratch our heads on the winner.

With Zelda 10 and AC, it's going to be yet another different ball game. I have no ****ing idea who I'd pick between the two.

Really? After Zelda 10 Link won't lose another contest for years.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Link could never build a solid lead until late in the morning. Unlike Cloud last year, who only needed an hour to take off with the match. This one wasn't locked in and done until the afternoon.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

By having Clink in the contest, they are taking up a huge number of matches that otherwise COULD be close, interesting matches. Nothing with Clink that isnt Cloud v. Link will be remotely close. They'll continue to waste ten or so matches a contest until they leave.

So, instead, we get to see Samus and Sephiroth take up a huge number of matches that otherwise COULD be close, interesting matches?

Jesus H. Christ. The inter-Noble Nine matches last ONE WEEK.
---
"Thank you, Mario. But our princess is in another castle."
-Toad in Super Mario Bros.

Really? After Zelda 10 Link won't lose another contest for years.

Yes, because we can see the future and know that Zelda 10 is the second coming of the Ocarina of Time and not Wind Waker, impact-wise. A new game does not guarantee dominance.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

It isn't anti-climactic at all... Have Linik and Cloud in Division 1. Have Seph and Samus in Division 2. Have Mario, Sonic, and Magus in Division 3. Have Crono, Zero, and Mega Man in Division 4. Not exactly the most predictable thing in the world, especially to the general public.
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I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]

Which is.....wow, my next sentence after that! What a coincidence.

Which totally defeats the purpose of arguing on removing Cloud/Link when you will have two characters to take their place on dominating the contest.

That solution would be better than what we have now, admittingly. But taking out Clink would be better.

I fail to see how, I really do.

Those four would each dominate their half divisions, no questions asked. With two of them missing, then suddenly there are two extra seats in the elite eight. Hm, I think I'd prefer that.

You have Link/Cloud in the elite 8 (great match), you have Samus/Sephiroth in the elite 8 (great match), you have Mario/Sonic in the elite 8 (great match), you have Mega Man/Crono in the elite 8 (great match). There's nothing wrong with any of those matches and it sets up for a great final four match while the other would be Samus/Sephiroth gaining 40%+ on Cloud or Link.

Also, sticking Cloud v. Link and Samus v. Sephy in the same divisions? Why not just stick them all at 1,2,8,9 seeds in North and clear up as much room as possible?

That would be awful. I'm not a fan of completely stacking divisions.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Surprising, considering it comes from the guy who splooges non-stop for a week every time new AC info is unveiled.
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Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

Of course, no matter where they are at it is the greatest match to see in a contest. Having that gone would just be terrible. I don't see how someone couldn't look forward to a match between the two.

Exactly, that match is a requirement for a good contest.

Unfortunately, whatever comes after that is a snooze-fest.

I beg to differ. Had Link not treated Megaman like a virgin on prom night, we would've had no idea who was going to win this year. With Zelda 10 and AC, it's going to be yet another different ball game. I have no ****ing idea who I'd pick between the two.

By saying "then", I actually meant "the end of the 5th round".

Hopefully that clears out your misunderstanding.

---
<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

Link could never build a solid lead until late in the morning. Unlike Cloud last year, who only needed an hour to take off with the match. This one wasn't locked in and done until the afternoon.

Are you kidding me? This match was over when I woke up. The only people who thought Cloud had a shot were kidding themselves.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

I think it was insulting. I had 152 ;_;

Sorry. I didn't mean anything by it. =(

No, Link was not. He never broke away from Cloud until late in the morning.

Link took control at about 05:15 -

04:45 | Link | 08633 | +0372 | 50.25% | Cloud | 08546 | +0424 | 49.75% | Lead of 0087 | (Down 52)
05:00 | Link | 09024 | +0391 | 50.16% | Cloud | 08968 | +0422 | 49.84% | Lead of 0056 | (Down 31)
05:15 | Link | 09520 | +0496 | 50.21% | Cloud | 09439 | +0471 | 49.79% | Lead of 0081 | (Up 25)
05:30 | Link | 10110 | +0590 | 50.34% | Cloud | 09972 | +0533 | 49.66% | Lead of 0138 | (Up 57)
05:45 | Link | 10753 | +0643 | 50.53% | Cloud | 10529 | +0557 | 49.47% | Lead of 0224 | (Up 86)
06:00 | Link | 11374 | +0621 | 50.60% | Cloud | 11104 | +0575 | 49.40% | Lead of 0270 | (Up 46)
06:15 | Link | 12046 | +0672 | 50.73% | Cloud | 11700 | +0596 | 49.27% | Lead of 0346 | (Up 76)
06:30 | Link | 12796 | +0750 | 50.85% | Cloud | 12367 | +0667 | 49.15% | Lead of 0429 | (Up 83)
06:45 | Link | 13566 | +0770 | 50.98% | Cloud | 13044 | +0677 | 49.02% | Lead of 0522 | (Up 93)
07:00 | Link | 14417 | +0851 | 51.19% | Cloud | 13747 | +0703 | 48.81% | Lead of 0670 | (Up 148)
07:15 | Link | 15329 | +0912 | 51.29% | Cloud | 14559 | +0812 | 48.71% | Lead of 0770 | (Up 100)
07:30 | Link | 16378 | +1049 | 51.54% | Cloud | 15400 | +0841 | 48.46% | Lead of 0978 | (Up 208)
07:45 | Link | 17443 | +1065 | 51.72% | Cloud | 16286 | +0886 | 48.28% | Lead of 1157 | (Up 179)
08:00 | Link | 18456 | +1013 | 51.84% | Cloud | 17147 | +0861 | 48.16% | Lead of 1309 | (Up 152)
08:15 | Link | 19514 | +1058 | 51.89% | Cloud | 18093 | +0946 | 48.11% | Lead of 1421 | (Up 112)
08:30 | Link | 20597 | +1083 | 52.05% | Cloud | 18978 | +0885 | 47.95% | Lead of 1619 | (Up 198)
08:45 | Link | 21720 | +1123 | 52.16% | Cloud | 19921 | +0943 | 47.84% | Lead of 1799 | (Up 180)
09:00 | Link | 22893 | +1173 | 52.22% | Cloud | 20950 | +1029 | 47.78% | Lead of 1943 | (Up 144)
09:15 | Link | 24067 | +1174 | 52.32% | Cloud | 21930 | +0980 | 47.68% | Lead of 2137 | (Up 194)
09:30 | Link | 25226 | +1159 | 52.34% | Cloud | 22969 | +1039 | 47.66% | Lead of 2257 | (Up 120)
09:45 | Link | 26399 | +1173 | 52.44% | Cloud | 23941 | +0972 | 47.56% | Lead of 2458 | (Up 201)
10:00 | Link | 27504 | +1105 | 52.46% | Cloud | 24924 | +0983 | 47.54% | Lead of 2580 | (Up 122)
10:15 | Link | 28637 | +1133 | 52.44% | Cloud | 25971 | +1047 | 47.56% | Lead of 2666 | (Up 86)
10:30 | Link | 29752 | +1115 | 52.51% | Cloud | 26912 | +0941 | 47.49% | Lead of 2840 | (Up 174)
10:45 | Link | 30879 | +1127 | 52.59% | Cloud | 27843 | +0931 | 47.41% | Lead of 3036 | (Up 196)
11:00 | Link | 31966 | +1087 | 52.62% | Cloud | 28779 | +0936 | 47.38% | Lead of 3187 | (Up 151)

---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Let me word it differently...

50% of the voters don't want to see Link or Cloud winning the championship every year. If we don't get rid of them, then we might as well get rid of the standard contest altogether.

---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think."

Yes, because replacing Link and Cloud would definitely start giving us interesting 1-16, 1-8/9, and 1-4/5 matches.

Er, well, more interesting than what we have. I advocate clearing out the gutters of this tournament as well - we could easily fill a bracket full of people who would all get at least fifteen-twenty percent on anyone they encountered.

And also, while 1-16 matches will never be highly disputable, later rounds at least have a chance if we start to clear away a bit of the top heaviness.

North
1 Crono
4 Vincent (Post AC and DoC)

*drool*

Oh, wait. I'd rather Vincent hit Cloud instead. That would be MUCH more interesting. Yay SFF!
---
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

Yes, because we can see the future and know that Zelda 10 is the second coming of the Ocarina of Time and not Wind Waker, impact-wise. A new game does not guarantee dominance.

I would be sorely disappointed for this game not to be downright amazing. As long as this game is good Link won't have a problem dominating this contest for years to come.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

But to say that Link had that thing won from the start was ridiculous because, as you said, Cloud came back and had the lead under 100 for a long while. Link didn't break 51% or even a 500 vote lead until 7 hours into the match.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

I didn't misunderstand anything AFAIK. What I was saying is, if Link/Megaman had gone down like it was supposed to, there would've been mass debates in the hours leading into the finals. Instead... well, you know the story.
---
Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

more interesting than what we have

What's more interesting in an obvious 65-35 match than an obvious 70-30 match?
---
Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

But to say that Link had that thing won from the start was ridiculous because, as you said, Cloud came back and had the lead under 100 for a long while. Link didn't break 51% or even a 500 vote lead until 7 hours into the match.

I posted the point where Link started to break away. ;)
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Surprising, considering it comes from the guy who splooges non-stop for a week every time new AC info is unveiled.

Unless Zelda 10 comes out before or during the contest next year I'll agree with you on it being a complete toss-up. Once Zelda 10 releases it becomes a different story... for me anyway.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Oh, wait. I'd rather Vincent hit Cloud instead. That would be MUCH more interesting. Yay SFF!

Oh wait, Crono and Vincent are both Square! Yay SFF again! Yay for an overseeded Vincent!
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Exactly, that match is a requirement for a good contest.

Unfortunately, whatever comes after that is a snooze-fest.

Yeah, and anything that comes before it that involves either of the two.

Also, what the hell is all this talk about "requirement for a good contest"? Link v Cloud drew a lot of votes, but it wasnt as if it was the be-all end-all of matches. The board was more interesting, by far, for quite a few matches during this contest.

Honestly, this contest turned into a wash for me the second Link hosed Megaman as badly as he did. I had hoped at least the match would be close, so that there could be some sort of upper-tier competition. But with that rout, our dreams of Sephimus Clinkman were shattered. If our upper tiers arent going to give us any interesting matchs at all, then why the hell keep them all for some crap ass notion of tradition?
---
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

50% of the voters don't want to see Link or Cloud winning the championship every year. If we don't get rid of them, then we might as well get rid of the standard contest altogether.

First off, it's 47%, which means that 53% of voters favor an alternate solution.

Second off, the whole GameFAQs userbase isn't voting.

Third off, we'll have no way of knowing if Cloud or Link will ever lose to another character if we take them out.

If Ceej removes Cloud and Link, you people WILL regret supporting this decision. Mark my ****ing words.
---
"Thank you, Mario. But our princess is in another castle."
-Toad in Super Mario Bros.

But to say that Link had that thing won from the start was ridiculous

I was saying that from roughly 2 hours into the match when I started watching. Cloud was never looking like taking a substantial lead, or a lead for that matter, even before the AOL users woke up and gave Link the match. I lost track of the number of "OMG Cloud's closing the lead" topics I posted the AOL quote in.
---
Jon Thomson - nifboy > me
Nominate Ridley for Summer Contest 2005

You have Link/Cloud in the elite 8 (great match), you have Samus/Sephiroth in the elite 8 (great match), you have Mario/Sonic in the elite 8 (great match), you have Mega Man/Crono in the elite 8 (great match). There's nothing wrong with any of those matches and it sets up for a great final four match while the other would be Samus/Sephiroth gaining 40%+ on Cloud or Link.

Current system:
- 2 bad quarters + 2 decent quarters.
- 2 bad semis.
- good final.
Pro: Climactic build-up towards the final
Con: Predictability

Your suggestion:
- 4 good quarters.
- 1 bad semi + 1 decent semi.
- bad final.
Pro: Better quarter-finals
Con: Involves underseeding/overseeding of the greatest proportions.

I'd say that the current system would be more favorable to the masses.

And the climactic build-up would net more visits to the site, with less people dissatisfied.

---
<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

Honestly, this contest turned into a wash for me the second Link hosed Megaman as badly as he did.

So, what, you thought the contest was boring for THREE matches?

Wow, I don't even have to try to own your arguments anymore. You're doing it yourself.
---
"Thank you, Mario. But our princess is in another castle."
-Toad in Super Mario Bros.

First off, it's 47%, which means that 53% of voters favor an alternate solution.

I thought of it more of ~47% saying Yes, ~44% saying No, and the rest could be considered "Undecided."

That's how I looked at the poll anyway.

---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

If CJayC does give these people what they want by removing winners, I hope he does this, just out of spite.

1st Division:

(1) Cloud Strife

No Link to be found.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Oh wait, Crono and Vincent are both Square! Yay SFF again! Yay for an overseeded Vincent!

The way CT and FF7 played out, I don't realistically think that Crono and Vincent would have much of a SFF factor going between them. Hell, you guys seem to deny even the possibility of Cloud v. Sephiroth SFF. Vincent getting his own game, as well as an appearance in AC that seems to flesh his character out even more, would probably make any SFF between him and Crono negligible.

And if you want to continue to harp on technicalities, replace Crono with Mario. Wow, THAT was hard...
---
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

It's not tradition, it's to determine the most popular character. The contest would essentially become one big fat lie if Link and Cloud are taken out.

If Samus dominates so much next year she looks like she could take down Link or Cloud, people will be BEGGING to have these two back. Samus' title would have no credibility then.
---
Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

Con: Predictability

Notice the con is exactly what we are arguing over.

Pro: Better quarter-finals

You forgot to add more unpredictable. And I don't see where the underseeding and overseeding are of the "...greatest proportions."
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

I was saying that from roughly 2 hours into the match when I started watching. Cloud was never looking like taking a substantial lead, or a lead for that matter, even before the AOL users woke up and gave Link the match. I lost track of the number of "OMG Cloud's closing the lead" topics I posted the AOL quote in.

I was actually worried that Cloud was going to take the lead:

02:00 | Link | 04692 | +0383 | 51.58% | Cloud | 04404 | +0423 | 48.42% | Lead of 0288 | (Down 40)
02:15 | Link | 05082 | +0390 | 51.43% | Cloud | 04800 | +0396 | 48.57% | Lead of 0282 | (Down 6)
02:30 | Link | 05444 | +0362 | 51.35% | Cloud | 05157 | +0357 | 48.65% | Lead of 0287 | (Up 5)
02:45 | Link | 05758 | +0314 | 51.06% | Cloud | 05519 | +0362 | 48.94% | Lead of 0239 | (Down 48)
03:00 | Link | 06087 | +0329 | 50.81% | Cloud | 05892 | +0373 | 49.19% | Lead of 0195 | (Down 44)
03:15 | Link | 06432 | +0345 | 50.68% | Cloud | 06259 | +0367 | 49.32% | Lead of 0173 | (Down 22)
03:30 | Link | 06767 | +0335 | 50.46% | Cloud | 06644 | +0385 | 49.54% | Lead of 0123 | (Down 50)
03:45 | Link | 07125 | +0358 | 50.47% | Cloud | 06992 | +0348 | 49.53% | Lead of 0133 | (Up 10)
04:00 | Link | 07470 | +0345 | 50.25% | Cloud | 07396 | +0404 | 49.75% | Lead of 0074 | (Down 59)
04:15 | Link | 07861 | +0391 | 50.40% | Cloud | 07737 | +0341 | 49.60% | Lead of 0124 | (Up 50)
04:30 | Link | 08261 | +0400 | 50.42% | Cloud | 08122 | +0385 | 49.58% | Lead of 0139 | (Up 15)
04:45 | Link | 08633 | +0372 | 50.25% | Cloud | 08546 | +0424 | 49.75% | Lead of 0087 | (Down 52)
05:00 | Link | 09024 | +0391 | 50.16% | Cloud | 08968 | +0422 | 49.84% | Lead of 0056 | (Down 31)

Of course, 05:15 hit soon afterwards and Link shot off like a rocket. But I was worried at the time.
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

The Hyrule Division was so bad that Yoshi finished 39th in the non-adjusted x-stats and was still the 6th strongest character in his division.

Worse is that CATS is the 9th strongest and Ganondorf the 10th despite being in the FIFTIES! That's really pathetic.
---
I'm safe until the next toss-up match, which is Bowser vs. Guybrush ~SuperLuigiBros
Nifboy pwned me with a plunger!

I'd think that some of that 25 percent, if that option didnt exist, would side with "Yes". The fact that even despite the advantage of having multiple choices "No" is still losing is a good sign as to the feeling of how annoying the predictability of this contest has been.
---
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

The way CT and FF7 played out, I don't realistically think that Crono and Vincent would have much of a SFF factor going between them.

How do we know there was no SFF involved?

Again, if we remove Link and Cloud, we just have Sephiroth and Samus winning it all for the next two years, and then people will start complaining that they need to be taken out or no one else will ever win. People are impossible to please.

Honestly, the winning character doesn't even mean that much to me. It's all of the matches leading up to it that make this contest great. All you need to do is tweak the bracket.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Will post this in here - choosing the #4-#5 matches in the bracket I'm doing. Squall, Ryu, Ganondorf and Tidus against Frog, Master Chief, Shadow and Bowser. The picking of the 5 seed topic was going like a train earlier, the saying where they go topic's dead:

http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16706895

Having said that, given the rate *this* topic is moving at, I doubt more than two people will notice this post...
---
Jon Thomson - nifboy > me
Nominate Ridley for Summer Contest 2005

No Link to be found.

That would suck so much.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

No Link to be found.

;_;
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

It sucks if you take either of the two out, but I hope it happens, just to spite the people who were begging for it.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

If CJayC does give these people what they want by removing winners, I hope he does this, just out of spite.

1st Division:

(1) Cloud Strife

No Link to be found.

Immature/10.

Wake up on the wrong side of the bed this morning?
---
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

I just LOOOOOVE how we can have a rational debate without resorting to insults. -_-
---
Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

No, I'm just getting irritated by people who think removing Link and Cloud magically solves the predictability problem.

You know the main thing that really makes this contest predictable? The availability of extrapolated rankings. Honestly, how many people would've taken Tidus to beat Shadow after seeing 45% on Mario if they didn't have the rankings to see that they were almost dead even? I probably wouldn't have.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

I just LOOOOOVE how we can have a rational debate without resorting to insults. -_-

OMG u sux. ^_~
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

In any case, only 20% of the voters in the poll even WANT the contest to be the exactly the same next year...I don't care if I'd regret getting a character deleted...I'd regret having a near identical contest next year no matter what, bar a miracle happens.

---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think."

Also, what the hell is all this talk about "requirement for a good contest"? Link v Cloud drew a lot of votes, but it wasnt as if it was the be-all end-all of matches. The board was more interesting, by far, for quite a few matches during this contest.

Yes, matches neither I nor anyone that doesn't have a bracket care about.

Sure, Frog vs. Liquid is a nail-biter for those with brackets, but the casuals could care less.

Honestly, this contest turned into a wash for me the second Link hosed Megaman as badly as he did. I had hoped at least the match would be close, so that there could be some sort of upper-tier competition. But with that rout, our dreams of Sephimus Clinkman were shattered. If our upper tiers arent going to give us any interesting matchs at all, then why the hell keep them all for some crap ass notion of tradition?

If you put Clink in the same division, it would be a wash for EVERYONE the moment the winner of Cloud vs. Link becomes official.

---
<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

So, what, you thought the contest was boring for THREE matches?

Wow, I don't even have to try to own your arguments anymore. You're doing it yourself.

RTFP, kindly.

By the contest, I mean the future of the contest. As in, this contest will happen again. Link and Cloud being this far ahead now, with all that they have on their plates for the next year or two, basicly ensures them a 1-2 finish for a while to come. And also ensrues that all matches involving them are even less interesting than they are now, were that even possible.
---
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

Honestly, how many people would've taken Tidus to beat Shadow after seeing 45% on Mario if they didn't have the rankings to see that they were almost dead even? I probably wouldn't have.

Those that thought Square RPG = Instant Win? I thought it was obvious, although people have said I have a pathological hatred of all things Sonic related, which is blatantly untrue. Sonic himself and his games are fine...
---
Jon Thomson - nifboy > me
Nominate Ridley for Summer Contest 2005

Well, there's always being really close to someone who got 35% on Link, so it all balances out. Sort of. I actually made a few good picks last year BECAUSE I didn't know of the X-Sts back then. It's a double-edged sword, really.
---
Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

Of course, I'd rather have something entirely different than just have a regular contest with the big forces taken out.

---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think."

Ah, well, even with knowledge of extrapolated rankings before the 2003 contest, it was still quite unpredictable due to the mass amounts of new characters that year. This year had hardly any notable new characters...

---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think."

Sure, Frog vs. Liquid is a nail-biter for those with brackets, but the casuals could care less.

Er, do the casuals give a rat's ass anyway? They vote, they get two seconds of jollies by seeing their character is winning, and then they dont give it a second thought.

If you put Clink in the same division, it would be a wash for EVERYONE the moment the winner of Cloud vs. Link becomes official.

That's the point. If theyre in the same division, the contest is over after their match. If they arent in the same division, then they hose through a lot of otherwise deserving characters. Neither of those outcomes is all that welcoming, personally.
---
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

On the surface, 45% on Mario looks a lot better than an indirect 35% on Link. That was one of the big arguments as to why Shadow would win this year.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

I think more detail should be placed on the first round matches to make the contest more unpredictable. Seeds are double edged swords.
---
My luck works best when things are... random. Mat Cauthon from The Dragon Reborn

And we're going to have less and less each year, because this year we had the last few newcomers who could do damage in a contest without going into blatant overrepresentation.
---
Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

On the surface, 45% on Mario looks a lot better than an indirect 35% on Link.

I never understood how that could be.
---
Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

Just replace Link and Cloud with Sephiroth and Samus, and you get the same result. All we need is a better crafted bracket.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Of course, I'd rather have something entirely different than just have a regular contest with the big forces taken out.

Same here. But, without that, I'm all for dropping the victors.

even with knowledge of extrapolated rankings before the 2003 contest, it was still quite unpredictable due to the mass amounts of new characters that year.

Part of the unpredictability was also due to the massive voter base change, that allowed Cloud to beat Link and Sephy to give a nice strong performance. Without another shift like that, nothign is gonna budge Clink from the untouchable position.
---
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

so what are you all "Discussing" about?
---
Summer 2004 Contest 181/192
Congrates to Nifboy, the guru winner, who had to PWN me just to get there

You forgot to add more unpredictable. And I don't see where the underseeding and overseeding are of the "...greatest proportions."

More unpredictable?
Only the quarters, the rest is just as much cake.

Each of Sephirmus Clink deserves a #1 seed, denying TWO of them of their deserved seed is a treachery by itself.

And the other 4 does NOT deserve a #1 seed, and giving them those seed over those more deserving is yet another treachery.

---
<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

Let's just stop already. Andaca will reply something to the effect of 65-35 matches being more interesting than 70-30 ones, like every other pro-retirement argument implies.
---
Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

I never understood how that could be.

Uhh...45% is a bigger number and Mario is an icon? Beats me. Getting beaten 65/35 is still getting blown out.

Plus, without the stats, we would have people predicting Magus to beat Mega Man next year.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

so what are you all "Discussing" about?

Basically, the merits of taking Clink out of the contest.
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

All we need is a better crafted bracket.

A better crafted bracket would be aided by having Clink dropped out the bottom.
---
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

A better crafted bracket would be aided by having Clink dropped out the bottom.

No.

Or, let's drop Samus and Sephiroth as well! BRILLIANT!
---
Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

Not really. You just have dominance to a lesser extent. No matter who you replace Link or Cloud with, none of them will stand a chance of winning.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

That's the point. If theyre in the same division, the contest is over after their match.

If knowing who the winners are going to be is a problem, then why do you continue to support taking out Link and Cloud, after ADMITTING YOURSELF that either Samus or Sephiroth will win in that situation?
---
"Thank you, Mario. But our princess is in another castle."
-Toad in Super Mario Bros.

Basically, the merits of taking Clink out of the contest.

still??? meh I don't fell like starting an arguement

anyway Slow do you still have the BOP for both this spring and summer?
---
Summer 2004 Contest 181/192
Congrates to Nifboy, the guru winner, who had to PWN me just to get there

Andaca will reply something to the effect of 65-35 matches being more interesting than 70-30 ones, like every other pro-retirement argument implies.

Rather, i think having ten fewer 80-20 blowouts a tournament might be interesting. Yeah, a lot of those might get replaced with 60-40's, but if a bracket were crafted intelligently you could get a lot of good new matches without Clink involved. Clink is good for one match, and one match only, and that one match is not worth the fact that an intelligent bracket maker could pull four or five good matches through the rearranging that would occur by dropping them.
---
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

More unpredictable?
Only the quarters, the rest is just as much cake.

All four elite matches are unpredictable, one semi-final match is unpredictable, and then round 1-round 3 can easily be crafted to be unpredictable.

Each of Sephirmus Clink deserves a #1 seed, denying TWO of them of their deserved seed is a treachery by itself.

You will never see a bracket based on pure strength, unless we were to make it, in this contest. Giving Samus a #2 seed finally gives Sephiroth his #1 seed and doesn't make it look nearly as bad.

And the other 4 does NOT deserve a #1 seed, and giving them those seed over those more deserving is yet another treachery.

Mario and Mega Man/Crono not worthy of getting a #1 seed? They all sound like fine candiates for a #1 seed to me, despite what the rankings say on strength. Besides, you act as if the seed is prominent in how they perform. Who cares if they aren't as strong as their seed suggest, or stronger than their seed suggest, if it can create better matches and a more unpredictable contest?
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Less 80-20 blowouts could be achieved by strengthening the lower part of the field. Bring on those who did well in 2002 and haven't seen a contest since. Bring on the rookies from games that scored well in the Spring Contest (Kerrigan and Nightmare for example).

Problem solved.
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Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

If on the off chance Ulti would let me join his analysis crew, I would like it.

Of course I say off chance because there's pretty much no chance :(
---
I'm safe until the next toss-up match, which is Bowser vs. Guybrush ~SuperLuigiBros
Nifboy pwned me with a plunger!

If knowing who the winners are going to be is a problem, then why do you continue to support taking out Link and Cloud, after ADMITTING YOURSELF that either Samus or Sephiroth will win in that situation?

Because by removing those two, you manage to rearrange the entire bracket - yes, Sephmius will take Clink's place in matches, and they will win those matches also. But everyone in the contest gets bumped up as well, not just Sephimus - suddenly, you get a lot more room for actual good matches.

I realize I need to make a bracket to try to illustrate my point here....lets see how badly my bracket making skills are, i gues...
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nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

Because by removing those two, you manage to rearrange the entire bracket - yes, Sephmius will take Clink's place in matches, and they will win those matches also. But everyone in the contest gets bumped up as well, not just Sephimus - suddenly, you get a lot more room for actual good matches.

Hmm, yes. Everyone gets bumped up a whopping two places.

I don't see why you think that removing Cloud and Link is going to somehow raise the quality of the contest to an orgasmic level.

And how many more good matches are we getting by removing Cloud and Link? ZERO.

Sephiroth. And. Samus. Will. Take. Their. Place.

Get it into your head.
---
"Thank you, Mario. But our princess is in another castle."
-Toad in Super Mario Bros.

I still have no idea why you would remove two characters just to have two characters take their place in dominance. *shrug*
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

**Repost, because someone marked both of them on a technicality. Now i know, but still....silly for a loss of 6 karma. I am glad that replacing the first letter with a * makes all the difference.**

132...Took Seph to win the contest...*shrug*

I would kill for a tournament of all new characters, or at least of characters who have never made it further than the sweet sixteen.

If it honestly came down to it though, I would not mind seeing Link and Cloud pulled from the contest. Yeah, it would mean that Seph or Samus would probably win it. But as it stands, Link or Cloud WILL win it next year. Even if you consider Seph/Cloud a SFF match, the gap between Clink and anyone else is unholy. In order to change that, you would need to massively change the voter composition of the site.

Also, taking those two out would allow for more interesting matches. I don't know about some of you, but personally i find little to no redeeming value to multiple rounds of massive blowouts. The only people these matches are interesting to are us stats freaks who sit around and argue over the implications of the differences between Insane Massacre A vs. Insane Massacre B. Hell, I even think a good chunk of us are getting fed up with those matches as well.

Additionally, those two guys are the biggest SFF grabbing fiends around. They make for boring matchups, and ruin the possibility of other people from their companies of ever being able to put on a show.

But if nothing else, just think fo the sheer number of matches they two of them would ruin. Anything involving Link or Cloud that ISNT Link v. Cloud is predetermined.

Think about it - If they arent in the same half of the bracket, then we have ten matches which, thanks to them, are a complete waste.

If theyre on the same half, but if different divisions, then we have a total of nine matchups in the contest that are a waste.

If theyre in the same division, there are eight matches in the tournament that suck.

Hell, even if we have them kick each others ass in the first round, we still end up with five stupid matches.

Yeah, its a popularity contest. But I'd be more than willing to see a few fewer votes coming from multis in the big draw matches if we had the possibility of seeing more matchups that we actually could give a **** about.
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nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm kicked my ass in the Summer Contest.

All four elite matches are unpredictable, one semi-final match is unpredictable, and then round 1-round 3 can easily be crafted to be unpredictable.

No, only the quarters will be more predictable.
The semis WILL be predictable once the quarters roll out.

The early rounds can be made more interesting WITHOUT stacking a division, just avoid SFF.

You will never see a bracket based on pure strength, unless we were to make it, in this contest. Giving Samus a #2 seed finally gives Sephiroth his #1 seed and doesn't make it look nearly as bad.

Not as bad, true, but still worse than what we have right now.

Mario and Mega Man/Crono not worthy of getting a #1 seed? They all sound like fine candiates for a #1 seed to me, despite what the rankings say on strength. Besides, you act as if the seed is prominent in how they perform. Who cares if they aren't as strong as their seed suggest, or stronger than their seed suggest, if it can create better matches and a more unpredictable contest?

A better contest is one with a climactic final, a battle between 2 chars who has the largest fanbases.

Unpredictability by itself does NOT make a contest more exciting.

Remember, think about the masses.
I'm sure MOST of them would be sorely disappointed to see Cloud or Link went out before the semis.

---
<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

If on the off chance Ulti would let me join his analysis crew, I would like it.

Of course I say off chance because there's pretty much no chance :(

I thought it was Moltar's. But Ulti seems to be making the offers. I dunno. ^_^;
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

A better contest is one with a climactic final, a battle between 2 chars who has the largest fanbases.

And guess which two characters have the largest fanbases on this site?

You won't have much of a foot if you keep shooting yourself in it.
---
"Thank you, Mario. But our princess is in another castle."
-Toad in Super Mario Bros.

Taking out Cloud and Link is a terrible idea.

It solves nothing. Instead of two characters named Link and Cloud dominating, you have one character dominating. With another having an outside shot.

HOW IS THAT ANY BETTER?

We're suddenly going to have fantastic 1/16 matches with Sephiroth instead of Link? Did you notice how Sephy blew out his opponent worse than Cloud this year? The 8's are going to challenge the 1's? Please The 4's (Bowser, Alucard, Sora, and Vivi) are going to challenge Seph? Did you notice how well the did on him this year? Your argument holds no merit whatsoever. Give it up.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Okay, this is my FIRST TRY at making a bracket so don't rip into it too hard... It's meants as SC2K5. It's also meant to be somewhat hard, not accurate with its seedings.



Division 1

(1) Link
(16) Lara Croft
(8) KOS-MOS
(9) Shadow

(5) Vivi
(12) MewTwo
(4) Solid Snake
(13) Morrigan

(6) Auron
(11) Luigi
(3) Ganondorf
(14) Strider Hiryu

(7) Chun Li
(10) Raiden
(2) Cloud
(15) Terry Bogard


Division 2

(1) Sephiroth
(16) Earthworm Jim
(8) Knuckles
(9) Protoman

(5) Liquid Snake
(12) Ness
(4) Alucard
(13) Sub-Zero

(6) Bowser
(11) Viewtiful Joe
(3) Ryu
(14) Ghaleon

(7) Donkey Kong
(10) Zidane
(2) Samus
(15) Crash Bandicoot


Division 3

(1) Mario
(16) PaperBoy
(8) Kirby
(9) Tidus

(5) Master Chief
(12) Jill Valentine
(4) Sora
(13) Captain Falcon

(6) Dante
(11) Marth
(3) Magus
(14) HK-47

(7) Yoshi
(10) Vincent
(2) Sonic
(15) Alastor (Viewtiful Joe)


Division 4

(1) Mega Man
(16) Daxter
(8) Ryu Hayabusa
(9) Tails

(5) Aeris
(12) Felix
(4) Frog
(13) Sarah Kerrigan

(6) Zelda
(11) Dr. Robotnik
(3) Zero
(14) Duke Nukem

(7) Squall
(10) Fox McCloud
(2) Crono
(15) CATS
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

I would kill for a tournament of all new characters, or at least of characters who have never made it further than the sweet sixteen.

And guess what, NOBODY WILL CARE about such a contest.

You'll see vote totals FAR BELOW 2002 levels.

If it honestly came down to it though, I would not mind seeing Link and Cloud pulled from the contest. Yeah, it would mean that Seph or Samus would probably win it. But as it stands, Link or Cloud WILL win it next year. Even if you consider Seph/Cloud a SFF match, the gap between Clink and anyone else is unholy. In order to change that, you would need to massively change the voter composition of the site.

Also, taking those two out would allow for more interesting matches. I don't know about some of you, but personally i find little to no redeeming value to multiple rounds of massive blowouts. The only people these matches are interesting to are us stats freaks who sit around and argue over the implications of the differences between Insane Massacre A vs. Insane Massacre B. Hell, I even think a good chunk of us are getting fed up with those matches as well.

All removing Clink will do is murder the vote totals.

Their fans will be so disappointed that they won't even bother voting.

And you're talking about more than 50% of GameFAQs population.

Additionally, those two guys are the biggest SFF grabbing fiends around. They make for boring matchups, and ruin the possibility of other people from their companies of ever being able to put on a show.

If you scatter chars from the same company across all divisions carefully, there will be very few ,if any, SFF matches left.

But if nothing else, just think fo the sheer number of matches they two of them would ruin. Anything involving Link or Cloud that ISNT Link v. Cloud is predetermined.

Think about it - If they arent in the same half of the bracket, then we have ten matches which, thanks to them, are a complete waste.

If theyre on the same half, but if different divisions, then we have a total of nine matchups in the contest that are a waste.

If theyre in the same division, there are eight matches in the tournament that suck.

Hell, even if we have them kick each others ass in the first round, we still end up with five stupid matches.

Yeah, its a popularity contest. But I'd be more than willing to see a few fewer votes coming from multis in the big draw matches if we had the possibility of seeing more matchups that we actually could give a **** about.

Unfortunately, the masses won't give a **** for those matches you're drooling over.

When they don't see Clink around, they'll say "**** this contest" and wait till next year.

---
<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

On bracket stacking Clink:

Elite 8
(1) Link
(2) Cloud

(1) Sephiroth
(2) Samus

(1) Crono
(2) Mega Man

(1) Mario
(2) Sonic

Every match there looks good to me.

Final Four:
Clink
Sephirmus

Crono/Mega Man
Mario

The first one is decent, the second could be very good

Championship:
Boring as hell.

Now, what's better? A solid week of good matches or one day of good matches? I'm all for the solid week.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Sorry MasterMage, but after Cloud vs. Link, I'll be gone for the rest of the contest.

Honestly, very few people will care for what happened after that battle.

---
<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

I still have no idea why you would remove two characters just to have two characters take their place in dominance. *shrug*

Not only that, but you guys claim that general interest would be lowered, as well. Of course, if interest is lessened, anyway, why don't we use my previous suggestion in that we take out all the characters who have won a division (in otherwords, the Super Seven)? The characters are close enough to each other that year-to-year volatilities will ensure unpredictability. Hey, and finally seeing lots of matches like Zero vs. Aeris, which we likely couldn't see otherwise... that would excite me.

Two things we have to deal with between keeping it the same or taking out characters:
1) Another likely boring contest
OR
2) Less interest by the average visitor, AND possibly being boring again unless you cut out enough characters to MAKE the later rounds unpredictable.

Now, if you can't handle either of those consequences (I'd pick the 2nd choice myself), why don't we just do something completely different?

Ack, but I can't forget one thing: If CJayC allows the stats crew to create the bracket, everything up to the division finals would probably be good, anyway. That's the only way I wouldn't mind another Link/Cloud character contest again.

---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think."

When they don't see Clink around, they'll say "**** this contest" and wait till next year.

I'd just like to elaborate on this a little bit with my own thoughts. I would say about 50% of the people want Clink gone. I would say that of the 50% who want them gone, 80% are silly and don't really understand WHAT makes the contest hard. 10% just want a new winner. 5% have actual SOMEWHAT reasonable arguments. The remaining 5% are just clueless. However, I would say that 95% will NOT stop being interested just because Clink stays, as long as there is a difficult bracket to interest them. On the other hand, of the 50% who want Clink to stay or don't care, I'd bet 50% would NOT be interested in Clink left.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

I dont' think cjayc is going to retire characters. Today's poll can be read two ways. First way is that a plurality wants to retire past winners. Second way is that the majority at least think it wont make a difference if you retire winners.
---
Mario Sunshine-120 Shines || BtT 3:38.99 || HRC 37,592.3 ||

If people are complaining about the rest of the elite 8 not mattering after Cloud/Link, why not make that the 4th division, and have Sephirmus in the 3rd, and the other matches the first 2 divisions.
---
Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

Division 1

(1) Link
(16) Lara Croft
(8) KOS-MOS
(9) Shadow
I'm not a fan of KM/Shadow, but if she gets a new game and Mega Man's blowout was legit...
(5) Vivi
(12) MewTwo
(4) Solid Snake
(13) Morrigan
Snake is out of Vivi's league. Stick Zero or Gdorf in here.
(6) Auron
(11) Luigi
(3) Ganondorf
(14) Strider Hiryu
I like that one, because it's hard to tell where Auron lies.
(7) Chun Li
(10) Raiden
(2) Cloud
(15) Terry Bogard
Chun Li seems awfully high.

Division 2

(1) Sephiroth
(16) Earthworm Jim
(8) Knuckles
(9) Protoman
Even Heroic Mario doesn't think Protoman suffered enough SFF to be competitve here
(5) Liquid Snake
(12) Ness
(4) Alucard
(13) Sub-Zero
Word. LS/Alucard rocks, because we don't know how high Liquid should be.
(6) Bowser
(11) Viewtiful Joe
(3) Ryu
(14) Ghaleon
I love that match.
(7) Donkey Kong
(10) Zidane
(2) Samus
(15) Crash Bandicoot
Heh.

Division 3

(1) Mario
(16) PaperBoy
(8) Kirby
(9) Tidus
OUCH, says I. Great 8/9
(5) Master Chief
(12) Jill Valentine
(4) Sora
(13) Captain Falcon
I'm of the opinion MC would kill Sora, but if you want to set up MC/Mario, go for it.
(6) Dante
(11) Marth
(3) Magus
(14) HK-47
Magus is out of Dante's league, but so are most other people and he needs a way to Sonic
(7) Yoshi
(10) Vincent
(2) Sonic
(15) Alastor (Viewtiful Joe)
Ouch, ouch ouch ouch ouch. I really like this division.

Division 4

(1) Mega Man
(16) Daxter
(8) Ryu Hayabusa
(9) Tails
At first I thought it was a bad match, but then I realized they are really close. Add an adjustment for pics, and you have a great 8/9.
(5) Aeris
(12) Felix
(4) Frog
(13) Sarah Kerrigan
I don't like SFF in Aeris/Frog
(6) Zelda
(11) Dr. Robotnik
(3) Zero
(14) Duke Nukem
Ouch again, if 20XXDF is too high.
(7) Squall
(10) Fox McCloud
(2) Crono
(15) CATS
Woah, Squally will blow out Fox.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Final Four:
Clink
Sephirmus

Crono/Mega Man
Mario

The first one is decent, the second could be very good

Championship:
Boring as hell.

Now, what's better? A solid week of good matches or one day of good matches? I'm all for the solid week.

Clink vs. Sephirmus will be at least a shut-out in favor of Clink, I wouldn't call that a good match at all.

Croman will easily dispose of Mario, it'll take a miracle for Mario to even put up a fight.

And there's no better way to disappoint the masses than to have a blow-out final match.

---
<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

Actually, sidharta, I think the fact that battles between two complete wimps can actually get okay vote totals signifies that people WILL still vote if we had all-new characters. I think the biggest problem is that there won't be very many bracket predictions.

---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think."

Actually, sidharta, I think the fact that battles between two complete wimps can actually get okay vote totals signifies that people WILL still vote if we had all-new characters. I think the biggest problem is that there won't be very many bracket predictions.

That's only because they know that their favorites are still out there.

That's why they keep coming back day after day waiting for their fave's turn.

And most of them will vote just for the heck of it.

Remember, people don't mark their calendars to remind themselves of the days when their faves will fight.

But if they see that their faves aren't even in to begin with, then they won't care anymore.

---
<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

Croman will easily dispose of Mario, it'll take a miracle for Mario to even put up a fight.

You're out of your mind if you believe that.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Snake is out of Vivi's league. Stick Zero or Gdorf in here

Don't want to SFF Ganon again and Zero is already in a good spot.

Chun Li seems awfully high.

She's supposed to. That was put in so that Raiden could have a way to pick up a seeding upset and throw off a bunch of poser brackets pretty early.

Even Heroic Mario doesn't think Protoman suffered enough SFF to be competitve here

That's half the fun in SFF. We don't know for sure if Protoman suffered enough. And after seeing what Zero did to Mega Man, I think that match could be fairly interesting.

Magus is out of Dante's league, but so are most other people and he needs a way to Sonic

Yeah, but I couldn't give Zero AND Magus a chance to try against Sonic all in one tournament without vastly overseeding one of the three.

I don't like SFF in Aeris/Frog

See, I'm not sure how much SFF would really hit in Aeris/Frog. Or who it would help for that matter. This match was being used before SC2K4 as a way to try and guage Frog. I think it would be fairly interesting to see how it plays out. Of course I could be wrong.

Woah, Squally will blow out Fox.

Yeah, I got lazy =P

Thanks for the comments. ^_^

The positive ones too. I'm not gonna comment on each one individually but they were nice. =)
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Clink vs. Sephirmus will be at least a shut-out in favor of Clink, I wouldn't call that a good match at all.

Croman will easily dispose of Mario, it'll take a miracle for Mario to even put up a fight.

Oh, like Cloud blew out Seph two years ago? What if he suffered SFF against Cloud? Then he could put up a fight on Link.

Mario won't put up a fight? He's not very far away from Mega Man or Crono, and he'll have several DS titles.

Personally, I'd rather see a week of good matches instead of what we had this year, but whatever.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Err, like Cloud blew out Seph last year. Sarcasm doesn't work when I screw up the facts.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Personally, I'd rather see a week of good matches instead of what we had this year, but whatever.

I'm with you.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

I think there needs to be a Ness vs. Tails match.
---
My luck works best when things are... random. Mat Cauthon from The Dragon Reborn

(7) Ness
(10) Serge

And

(7) Miles "Tails" Prower
(10) Morrigan Aensland

Morri would actually be expected to win that, to all you people crying "overseeded!" when you see that.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Go Morrigan!
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

There's no way I'd give either of those matches to their 10 seeds anyway.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

I'm almost done with a complete overhaul of my bracket based on this year's stats. I'll post it soon.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Say HM, who would you predict in Mario vs Mega Man?
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Really? I'd definitely pick Serge, and I might pick Morri.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Say HM, who would you predict in Mario vs Mega Man?

Ouch.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Well I may have a bit of a bias seeing as I've never played Crono Cross but I would not imagine Serge taking that. As for Morri/Tails, I'm usually a fiercely loyal Sonic fan, just picked Ryu for my upset special this year =P
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

megaman!
---
RPG Elite (777) Dragoon Choco-Mage
From the ashes of Reito rose a new kami, and thereafter at every battle came Horobi, Death's wail.

Say HM, who would you predict in Mario vs Mega Man?

Ouch.

Lol. I'm just wondering cause I set up the potential for it in my bracket that I posted.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Not only are those my top two favorite characters, but even by stats that's an absolute pain to predict.

You have Mega Man X8 coming out for Mega Man within the coming year. On the flip side Mario has Super Mario 64 DS, Super Mario Bros. DS, and Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door as his prominent titles. Right now, Mega Man wins this one with 51.69%.

Seeing that match makes me cry. >>
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

(7) Ness
(10) Serge

Ouch. Harder than it looks at first. I'd go with Serge, though.

(7) Miles "Tails" Prower
(10) Morrigan Aensland

Tails, easily. That's not to detract from Morrigan, though, because it would be close.

Those are two good matches, though.

---
It's David Bowie vs. Johnny Depp at www.rpgdl.com, with a side order of Omnislash!
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm > me.

I think Tails vs Ryu at 8, 9 is more *****y but that may just be because I would have trouble who to pick personally whereas I can't see Morrigan putting up a decent fight as a 10 seed. Ness vs Serge on the other hand is still a far better utilization of Ness than what I used him for in my bracket.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

How about this?

(7) Luigi
(10) Strider Hiryu

I'll note that Strider would be expected to win convincingly.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Disregard that. I was comparing Link 2k4 for Luigi to Link 2k3 for Strider. Luigi would be expected to win a close match.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

How about this?

(7) Luigi
(10) Strider Hiryu

I'll note that Strider would be expected to win convincingly.

I wasn't aware Strider was ever even in. I would, once again, take the seven seed. This time I have more justification though. Luigi in Super Mario 64 = insta-win. Same for Yoshi and Wario.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Strider being back into the contest makes it an overall better place. =p With that said, I would take Luigi in that match.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

^^^

That should say Luigi in Super Mario 64 DS. Also, had I known Strider was ever in, he wouldn't be a 14 seed in my bracket PROBABLY. However, I think he has most likely suffered a massive, relative decrease in the past year seeing as a lot of the characters have apparently gained in reality.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Wait, Strider was in two years ago. Make that I'm sure he has suffered a massive, relative decrease by now.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

If you could, I would put Fox up against a character that would be more evenly matched. Squall should beat him, although not by any wide margin. I would also ditch Jill and add Leon Kennedy.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

HM: Noticing the discrepancy in the Link v Megaman match, call it SFF or whatever, do you think that Mario might also be able to pull a similar amount of whatever factor it might be from Megaman?
---
Pwned by Nifboy, ps2rulezzz, & hogasm in the 2k4 Guru Challenge.
Congrats.

Hm... I'm trying to find a place for Squall but I don't think I can put him anywhere without massively underseeding him...
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Although... I think I found a good place for him despite the blatant underseeding it causes.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Division 1

(1) Link
(16) Lara Croft
(8) KOS-MOS
(9) Shadow

(5) Vivi
(12) Viewtiful Joe
(4) Solid Snake
(13) Morrigan

(6) Auron
(11) Luigi
(3) Ganondorf
(14) Strider Hiryu

(7) Chun Li
(10) Raiden
(2) Cloud
(15) Terry Bogard

Division 2

(1) Sephiroth
(16) Earthworm Jim
(8) Knuckles
(9) Protoman

(5) Liquid Snake
(12) Ness
(4) Alucard
(13) Sub-Zero

(6) Bowser
(11) Squall
(3) Ryu
(14) Ghaleon

(7) Donkey Kong
(10) Zidane
(2) Samus
(15) Crash Bandicoot


Division 3

(1) Mario
(16) PaperBoy
(8) Kirby
(9) Tidus

(5) Master Chief
(12) Leon Kennedy
(4) Sora
(13) Captain Falcon

(6) Dante
(11) Marth
(3) Magus
(14) HK-47

(7) Yoshi
(10) Vincent
(2) Sonic
(15) Alastor (Viewtiful Joe)


Division 4

(1) Mega Man
(16) Daxter
(8) Ryu Hayabusa
(9) Tails

(5) Aeris
(12) Felix
(4) Frog
(13) Sarah Kerrigan

(6) Zelda
(11) Dr. Robotnik
(3) Zero
(14) Duke Nukem

(7) Tommy Vercetti
(10) Fox McCloud
(2) Crono
(15) CATS

Had to snub MewTwo but gave Squall a tough match in Bowser.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Had to snub MewTwo but gave Squall a tough match in Bowser.

*glares at you*
---
Summer 2004 Contest 181/192
Congrates to Nifboy, the guru winner, who had to PWN me just to get there

(6) Bowser
(11) Squall
(3) Ryu

Predicting that would be insane.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

In fact here's what we've got:

17. Ryu (29.84%)
18. Squall (29.58%)
19. Bowser (28.88%)
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Alrighty. The completely overhauled version on my bracket, with the expected % vs 2k3 Link thrown in for kicks. That %, by the way, is from my stats, not because I think mine are better than CN's (they're not), but because they were right in front of me.

The top 24 performing characters this year got seeds 1-6 (Not in order, of course. Just overall). The rest was a free for all, and yes, I know very well who I vastly underseeded. I also haven't done much more than a cursory check for SFF, so point out any that you see. Finally, I bolded my favorite four pack. Enjoy!

SOLDIERS of Hyrule
(1) Link 54.46
(16) Bomberman 22.36
(8) Zidane Tribal
(9) Raiden 12.29 *Massive SFF against Snake

(4) Liquid Snake 32.10
(13) Kefka 22.75
(5) Squall Leonhart 31.72
(12) Ken Masters 21.71

(3) Ganondorf 34.72
(14) Ghaleon
(6) Ryu 32.77
(11) Protoman 23.81

(7) Luigi 25.24
(10) KOS-MOS 24.82
(2) Cloud Strife 52.74
(15) Princess Peach

Meteors on Zebes
(1) Sephiroth 46.56
(16) Nightmare
(8) Yoshi 27.05
(9) Knuckles the Echidna 26.74

(4) Solid Snake 33.05
(13) Sigma
(5) Zero 33.28
(12) Sub-Zero

(3) Vivi Ornitier 29.10
(14) Zelda 30.29
(6) Alucard 29.75
(11) Vincent Valentine

(7) Miles "Tails" Prower 23.85
(10) Morrigan Aensland 24.87
(2) Samus Aran 42.36
(15) Bass

Time Travel to 20XX
(1) Crono 40.83
(16) HK-47 20.41
(8) Donkey Kong 25.34
(9) Leon Kennedy

(4) Kirby 28.54
(13) Tidus 27.19
(5) Sora 29.62
(12) Protoman 23.81

(3) Auron 30.99
(14) Ryu Hayabusa 22.68
(6) Bowser 30.97
(11) Strider Hiryu 24.23

(7) Viewtiful Joe 21.56
(10) Fox McCloud 18.99 (SFF?)
(2) Mega Man 38.60
(15) Geno

Chaos in the Mushroom Kingdom
(1) Mario 38.18
(16) Vyse 19.67
(8) Terra Branford
(9) Sarah Kerrigan

(4) Frog 32.13
(13) Carl Johnson
(5) Dante 27.99
(12) Shadow the Hedgehog 26.75

(3) Magus Zeal 34.93
(14) Lloyd Irving
(6) Master Chief 32.13
(11) Aeris Gainsborough 32.81

(7) Ness 21.67
(10) Serge
(2) Sonic the Hedgehog 36.86
(15) Kratos Aurion

Comments welcome.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

YAA Squall could be out in round one...

Such happy thoughts...

*glares at you*

I was no happier. V_V

I am a big pokemon fan in fact. Battle online a bunch, though I haven't as much lately.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

(2) Cloud Strife 52.74
(15) Princess Peach

Poor Peach. =(
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

sorry RPG the seeding is really screwed up in the new one

(1) Link 54.46
(16) Bomberman 22.36
(8) Zidane Tribal
(9) Raiden 12.29 *Massive SFF against Snake

(4) Liquid Snake 32.10
(13) Kefka 22.75
(5) Squall Leonhart 31.72
(12) Ken Masters 21.71

(3) Ganondorf 34.72
(14) Ghaleon
(6) Ryu 32.77
(11) Protoman 23.81

(7) Luigi 25.24
(10) KOS-MOS 24.82
(2) Cloud Strife 52.74
(15) Princess Peach

Meteors on Zebes
(1) Sephiroth 46.56
(16) Nightmare
(8) Yoshi 27.05
(9) Knuckles the Echidna 26.74

(4) Solid Snake 33.05
(13) Sigma
(5) Zero 33.28
(12) Sub-Zero

(3) Vivi Ornitier 29.10
(14) Zelda 30.29

WOO WOO WOO. The favorite in this 4-some is the 14 SEED??

(6) Alucard 29.75
(11) Vincent Valentine

(7) Miles "Tails" Prower 23.85
(10) Morrigan Aensland 24.87
(2) Samus Aran 42.36
(15) Bass

Time Travel to 20XX
(1) Crono 40.83
(16) HK-47 20.41
(8) Donkey Kong 25.34
(9) Leon Kennedy

(4) Kirby 28.54
(13) Tidus 27.19

(5) Sora 29.62
(12) Protoman 23.81

Wow the favorite in this one is the 12 SEED

(3) Auron 30.99
(14) Ryu Hayabusa 22.68

RYU didnt do that bad.

(6) Bowser 30.97
(11) Strider Hiryu 24.23

(7) Viewtiful Joe 21.56
(10) Fox McCloud 18.99 (SFF?)
(2) Mega Man 38.60
(15) Geno

Chaos in the Mushroom Kingdom
(1) Mario 38.18
(16) Vyse 19.67
(8) Terra Branford
(9) Sarah Kerrigan

(4) Frog 32.13
(13) Carl Johnson
(5) Dante 27.99
(12) Shadow the Hedgehog 26.75

Shadow a 12 seed?? I mean I know the X-Stats werent kind to him, but come on here.

(3) Magus Zeal 34.93
(14) Lloyd Irving
(6) Master Chief 32.13
(11) Aeris Gainsborough 32.81

(7) Ness 21.67
(10) Serge
(2) Sonic the Hedgehog 36.86
(15) Kratos Aurion

I said I knew damn well who I underseeded. This is in the interest of making the most competitive bracket, not the most accurate. And Protoman is not the favorite in his four pack; you might want to look over that again.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

I meant Tidus.

Does anyone have a link to show our final scores?
---
Happiness is like peeing on yourself. Everyone can see it, but only you feel it's warmth.

Screw the seeding. It allows for much better matchups.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Thank you, Heroic Mario. The matches are important. The seeds are not.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

I know why you did it. You gave the 7-10 seed and 15-16 to all the weaker characters. I just dont agree with that philosphy.

I still think you can make these contests very interesting without giving some characters the straight middle finger in seeding.

SOLDIERS of Hyrule
(1) Link 54.46
(16) Bomberman 22.36
(8) Zidane Tribal
(9) Raiden 12.29 *Massive SFF against Snake

That's pretty nice. I would be willing to bet that Zidane's Final Fantasy affiliation would pull him through. Maybe if the seeds were switched it would bring that somewhat closer by giving Raiden the seed advantage from the bracket makers who don't really know what they are doing.

(4) Liquid Snake 32.10
(13) Kefka 22.75
(5) Squall Leonhart 31.72
(12) Ken Masters 21.71


Nice 4/5 for the same reason you said Liquid is good in mine. We really can't judge him.

(3) Ganondorf 34.72
(14) Ghaleon
(6) Ryu 32.77
(11) Protoman 23.81

Nice. I would actually take Ryu here but that isn't an easy one by any means.

(7) Luigi 25.24
(10) KOS-MOS 24.82
(2) Cloud Strife 52.74
(15) Princess Peach

PRINCESS PEACH! I knew I forgot someone. I think she should be put to more of a test than simple 15 seed fodder but that isn't exactly easy to set up. As for Luigi vs KOS-MOS, I think Luigi would take it easier than the stats dictate.

Meteors on Zebes
(1) Sephiroth 46.56
(16) Nightmare
(8) Yoshi 27.05
(9) Knuckles the Echidna 26.74

Heh. 8/9s are really great for painful to predict matches and this is by no means an exception.

(4) Solid Snake 33.05
(13) Sigma
(5) Zero 33.28
(12) Sub-Zero

I love the testing of Zero on what appears to be a weaker Snake. Not easy at all.

(3) Vivi Ornitier 29.10
(14) Zelda 30.29
(6) Alucard 29.75
(11) Vincent Valentine

That is SUCH an awesome 4-pack. Oh man does that sting. The only thing I don't like is that potential SFF in Vivi vs Vincent if it happened.

(7) Miles "Tails" Prower 23.85
(10) Morrigan Aensland 24.87
(2) Samus Aran 42.36
(15) Bass

I already commented on this. I would take Tails and wouldn't really think but it has great bracket buster potential if that seeding upset happened.

Time Travel to 20XX
(1) Crono 40.83
(16) HK-47 20.41
(8) Donkey Kong 25.34
(9) Leon Kennedy

Hm. I don't like this 8/9 as much as your others. I think DK would handle Leon fairly easily.

(4) Kirby 28.54
(13) Tidus 27.19
(5) Sora 29.62
(12) Protoman 23.81

That's a nice little painful pack. We can't really judge Protoman so the 12/5 upset COULD happen and the 4/13 match is a pain. The end of that 4 pack is equally as painful.

(3) Auron 30.99
(14) Ryu Hayabusa 22.68
(6) Bowser 30.97
(11) Strider Hiryu 24.23

Bowser/Auron hurts. A lot.

(7) Viewtiful Joe 21.56
(10) Fox McCloud 18.99 (SFF?)
(2) Mega Man 38.60
(15) Geno

Fox definitely felt SFF and he would probably handle Joe pretty well.

Chaos in the Mushroom Kingdom
(1) Mario 38.18
(16) Vyse 19.67
(8) Terra Branford
(9) Sarah Kerrigan

Nice 8/9. Two newcomers. I would probably take Kerrigan here. But I would have severe doubts the whole time.

(4) Frog 32.13
(13) Carl Johnson
(5) Dante 27.99
(12) Shadow the Hedgehog 26.75

*blink* Ouch...

(3) Magus Zeal 34.93
(14) Lloyd Irving
(6) Master Chief 32.13
(11) Aeris Gainsborough 32.81


That would be painful to a lot of brackets this year but next year I think Master Chief would lock that up fairly easily. Still, AWESOME bracket buster.

(7) Ness 21.67
(10) Serge
(2) Sonic the Hedgehog 36.86
(15) Kratos Aurion

You know how I feel there. I don't know enough about Serge to make a very well-formed opinion.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Three of my favorites--who would be new to the bracket--seem to get the shaft, though. Sigma, Bass, and Peach. I think all three could cause some noise (mid-20's in the 2k4 X-sts).
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Leon would beat DK easily.

EASILY.

I still think you can make these contests very interesting without giving some characters the straight middle finger in seeding.

You can, it's just generally worse. If seeding was accurate in these things everytime, we would KNOW who would win every match except the 1/2, 4/5 and 8/9 matches.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

I'm going for as many close, unpredictable matches as possible. If that means characters have to be over/underseeded, so be it. It makes for the best bracket.

What's more exciting, a close, competitive four pack (like the one I bolded), or one that's just going to come down to the 4/5? There's a much greater opportunity to lose points in a competitive 4 pack, and there's closer, more exciting matches. I can't imagine what's wrong with it. Tidus and Shadow deserve 7's, true, but what's the fun of seeing them blow out a 10 and then bow out to the 2?
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Actually, the more I look at it the more I start to agree with it.

The only thing I do is switch out some of the weaker 11-14 with some of the newcomers who have been stuck in the 7-10 positions.

Switch Protoman with Leon for example.

Leon would beat DK easily.

No way. Both of them have game(s) coming out within the coming year, and both of them look great.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Nah, I think Leon would get handled, as I said.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

I'd take Leon in Leon/DK, and the fact that we're arguing about it proves he was seeded right. It's nice to know that almost every four pack of mine gets an ouch! from MasterMage. ;)
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Oh please dont try to compare the impact of DK:JB and RE4.

While they both look great, one will break a million sales, the other will be lucky to break 200,000.

To people complaining that a contest filled of entirely new characters would have low vote totals:

Who cares???


Well, except Ceej.
---
I was PWNed by nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm.

DK was barely over a percent stronger than Jill! She hasn't had a new game in two years and that was a REMAKE!

Leon would break 56 on him.

I'd take Leon in Leon/DK, and the fact that we're arguing about it proves he was seeded right. It's nice to know that almost every four pack of mine gets an ouch! from MasterMage. ;)

Lol. Yep. The only real complaint I have to make aobut that is there are no breaks in craziness, which is really good except that I wouldn't want to deal with 63 straight matches of head pain.

I think both of our brackets came out very well though. I think Peach should be given a better chance though.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Oh please dont try to compare the impact of DK:JB and RE4.

You've already got Donkey Kong's status, his mid-ranking position, and a couple of brand-new games he hasn't seen in a long while. On the flip side, Leon hasn't been proven to be strong or weak within one of the contests. He does have a brand-new starring role in one of the most anticipated games coming out. There's no way either one of them takes it easily. I like both, and both companies, but no way either one takes it easily. You'd be asinine to believe such.

While they both look great, one will break a million sales, the other will be lucky to break 200,000.

Both of them will sell extremely well, no doubt. Resident Evil 4 will sell more however.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

No because Leon situation is very similiar to Vincent's and I can easily see Vincent would dominate DK.

To people complaining that a contest filled of entirely new characters would have low vote totals:
Who cares???
Well, except Ceej.

The casual voters would. The main goal of a bracket is to make it entertaining for everyone. That means making it hard to predict, but also full of characters that people would like to see. Blank vs. Axle Gear may look good on paper, and it might turn out to be a great match. But most people probably aren't going to care about a match between a minor FF IX character and the villain in an obscure Konami series.
---
It's David Bowie vs. Johnny Depp at www.rpgdl.com, with a side order of Omnislash!
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm > me.

I think my bracket (and MM's) is proof enough you can have a brutal, punishing, point stealing bracket with Clink in the mix.

Look at my bracket. Can you see yourself pulling out 190 points on that monster?
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"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Im just saying according to the X-Stats, DK would have his hands full with Jill. Jill had REmake two years ago and RE 3, 5 years ago.

I don't see how Leon, who was the co-star of the most popular RE title in the series and the star of a title which looks to be one of the huge titles of next year, would not be much stronger than Jill next year.

No because Leon situation is very similiar to Vincent's and I can easily see Vincent would dominate DK.

Leon isn't Vincent. The two wouldn't be close to even in popularity.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

I don't suppose anyone wants to see mine again, but I think it can stand up to those two.
---
Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

Look at my bracket. Can you see yourself pulling out 190 points on that monster?

I'd be happy with a -40 after weeks of analysis on who to pick on every match... Which is the other good thing. I like the fact that you could conceivably get the final wrong and win. Of course, Clink in the same division lessens the likelihood of that but still.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

You act as if Donkey Kong wouldn't be increasing within the coming year either.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

I don't suppose anyone wants to see mine again, but I think it can stand up to those two.

Sure. Post it.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Look at my bracket. Can you see yourself pulling out 190 points on that monster?

Not a chance.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Oh please... DK:JB will have as much impact on him as MMAC had on Mega Man.

If there's a glaring mistake in there (Snub, repeat match, etc.) tell me. I tend to make those mistakes when I do stuff like this. Also, I purposely stacked Mario's division. However, there may be the chance of Mario vs. Crono IV in the Final Four.

Divison 1

1)Link
16) (Winner of Gordon/CATS, a Board Only match)

8) Terra
9) Tails

5) Ryu (SF)
12) Vincent Valentine

4) Auron
13) Ridley

6) Alucard
11) Ryu Hayabusa

3) Frog
14) Dr. Wily

7) Viewtiful Joe
10) Serge

2) Cloud
15) Toad

Division 2

1)Sephiroth
16) Laharl

8) Fox McCloud
9) Scorpion

4) Dante
13) KOS-MOS

5) Sora
12) Ken Masters

6) Zelda
11) Liquid Snake

3) Aeris
14) Diddy Kong

7) Ness
10) Protoman

2)Samus
15)Vyse

Division 3

1)Mario
16) Pac-Man

8) Yoshi
9) Knuckles

4) Squall
13) MewTwo

5) Bowser
12) Carl Johnson

6) Magus
11) Raiden

3) Solid Snake
14) Bass

7) Luigi
10) Kefka

2)Sonic the Hedgehog
15)Duke Nukem

Division 4

1)Mega Man
16)Crash Bandicoot

8) Kirby
9) Leon S. Kennedy

5) Ganondorf
12) Zidane

4) Master Chief
13) Jill Valentine

6) Tidus
11) Lloyd Irving

3) Zero
14)Jak

7) Vivi
10) Kerrigan

2) Crono

---
Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

15) Falco Lombardi
---
Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

RPG, unless I got lucky I dont think I be able to. There about 5 matches which are just complete toss-ups to me.

(5) Zero 33.28
(12) Sub-Zero

This one got a laugh out of me. I mean, hell, if anyone facing sweet 16 material is out in the first round anyway, may as well put them in funny matches.

(3) Vivi Ornitier 29.10
(14) Zelda 30.29
(6) Alucard 29.75
(11) Vincent Valentine

Eeeevil.
---
Co-champion of the Summer 2k4 Guru bracket challenge, along with ps2rulezz and Hogasm, with 190 points!

I take Zelda in a heartbeat out of that 4-Pack. Alucard vs Vincent would give me nightmares though.

HM, I think you seriously are overvaluing Vincent's strength. I see him around Alucard strength.

1)Link
16) (Winner of Gordon/CATS, a Board Only match)

Blah Blah.

8) Terra
9) Tails

Pretty tough. I'd probably take Terra.

5) Ryu (SF)
12) Vincent Valentine

I doubt Vincent, the 4th level of FF7 could take Ryu so no 12/5 upsets here =P

4) Auron
13) Ridley

Auron of course.

6) Alucard
11) Ryu Hayabusa

Alucard takes that too easily..

3) Frog
14) Dr. Wily

Frog with ease. But the 3/6 in that four pack is nice.

7) Viewtiful Joe
10) Serge

I know squat about Serge so I can't comment.

2) Cloud
15) Toad

Division 2

1)Sephiroth
16) Laharl

Blah.

8) Fox McCloud
9) Scorpion

I think Scorpion will lose too easily there.

4) Dante
13) KOS-MOS

Dante of couse. Dante vs Fox is hard though.

5) Sora
12) Ken Masters

Sora.

6) Zelda
11) Liquid Snake

Tough thanks to us not knowing Liquid Snake's strength. That goes for the whole four pack.

3) Aeris
14) Diddy Kong

Aeris easily of course.

7) Ness
10) Protoman

Another pretty good match since we can't know Protoman's real strength. But then Aeris wins too easily.

2)Samus
15)Vyse

Yaya.

Division 3

1)Mario
16) Pac-Man

Uh Huh.

8) Yoshi
9) Knuckles

Very hard match.

4) Squall
13) MewTwo

Squall easily. But yay for Mewtwo being there!

5) Bowser
12) Carl Johnson

Bowser followed by Bowser/Squall, a hellish match to predict.

6) Magus
11) Raiden

Magus too easily. A better character should be underseeded to give Magus trouble.

3) Solid Snake
14) Bass

Snake. Then I don't know between Snake and Magus cause it's a good 4-pack finisher.

7) Luigi
10) Kefka

I'd take Luigi.

2)Sonic the Hedgehog
15)Duke Nukem

Yaya.

Division 4

1)Mega Man
16)Crash Bandicoot

Uh huh.

8) Kirby
9) Leon S. Kennedy

That one's good.

5) Ganondorf
12) Zidane

I'd say Ganondorf takes that easily.

4) Master Chief
13) Jill Valentine

MC then a fairly tough match though I'd take Master Chief and wouldn't think too much if this was next year.

6) Tidus
11) Lloyd Irving

Tidus.

3) Zero
14)Jak

Zero then another tough match.

7) Vivi
10) Kerrigan

Kerrigan wouldn't make noise in this contest. Vivi.

2) Crono
15) *fodder*

I assume the 15 isn't some vastly underseeded 2 seed.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

I'm in an analyzing mood, so here goes:

Divison 1

1)Link
16) (Winner of Gordon/CATS, a Board Only match)

8) Terra
9) Tails
Good. Kefka would nearly beat Tails, and I'd pick Terra over Kefka, but I like it.
5) Ryu (SF)
12) Vincent Valentine
Vincent might be a big boy, but he won't be as big as Ryu
4) Auron
13) Ridley
Auron/Ryu hurts. But Ridley?
6) Alucard
11) Ryu Hayabusa

3) Frog
14) Dr. Wily
Alucard doesn't stand a chance against Froggy.
7) Viewtiful Joe
10) Serge
Heh. I like this. Serge
2) Cloud
15) Toad
Hooray for Clink stacking! Be wary of Cloud/Frog and Cloud/Serge SFF
Division 2

1)Sephiroth
16) Laharl

8) Fox McCloud
9) Scorpion
I'd sub in Sub-Zero, but it's your choice
4) Dante
13) KOS-MOS
KOS is a little low, what with XS2 and all.
5) Sora
12) Ken Masters
I'd pay money to see ertyu's reaction if Sora won
6) Zelda
11) Liquid Snake
Ouch
3) Aeris
14) Diddy Kong
Zelda/Aeris, which everyone wants to see.
7) Ness
10) Protoman
Battle of the wimps! I like.
2)Samus
15)Vyse
Huzzah for Samus/Seph! But beware of Samus/Ness, possible Samus/Zelda, and Seph/Sora SFF
Division 3

1)Mario
16) Pac-Man

8) Yoshi
9) Knuckles
My version came first. :-p
4) Squall
13) MewTwo

5) Bowser
12) Carl Johnson
Squally/Bowser is nice.
6) Magus
11) Raiden

3) Solid Snake
14) Bass
I heart Magus/Snake/Sonic
7) Luigi
10) Kefka
They have a common opponent, whom Luigi killed. I don't like this one.
2)Sonic the Hedgehog
15)Duke Nukem

Division 4

1)Mega Man
16)Crash Bandicoot

8) Kirby
9) Leon S. Kennedy
I think the Kirb meister is a little high for Leon.
5) Ganondorf
12) Zidane
Gdorf/MC hurts
4) Master Chief
13) Jill Valentine

6) Tidus
11) Lloyd Irving

3) Zero
14)Jak
Zero beats Tidus without a problem, even if Tidus did underperform on Mega.
7) Vivi
10) Kerrigan
Vivi wins, easily, but I can see people that would bite.
2) Crono
Beware Crono/Vivi SFF
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

All in all outback, I think your bracket is pretty nice but it has a bit too much SFF potential and not enough round one head smashers.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Oh please... DK:JB will have as much impact on him as MMAC had on Mega Man.

I still can't believe MMAC didn't do anything to Mega Man. That stupid final four match screwed up everything, because he was clearly on pace for an increase in the standings. *sigh*

Oh and the difference being that Donkey Kong hasn't had a game this generation up until Donkey Konga and, later in 2005, Donkey Kong: Jungle Beat. The latter being an actual platformer.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

HM, I think you seriously are overvaluing Vincent's strength. I see him around Alucard strength.

And I think you completely underestimate him. I couldn't see him being lower than Aeris.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

I've got a question for you, RPGuy. Would you see Squall/Ken or Squall/Sigma more interesting?
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Would you see Squall/Ken or Squall/Sigma more interesting?

I'm not RPG but I'd say Sigma.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

I don't think either would put up much of a fight, but if you want me to switch them, I will. That means Ken gets blown out by Solid Snake, though.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Yeah niether would do much of anything to Squall. They'd have to be almost on par with Ryu for any impact.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Well, Ken is going to lose either way and with Sigma being untested--and someone who I could easily putting up a fight against Squall--I figured it'd be a better match. Your call though.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

All right. Consider them switched.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Remember though Sigma is the villain of the MMX series. We didn't expect Liquid Snake to do anything at first either, but look how well he did. He shouldn't do terribly at all.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

And before anyone bites my head off on the comparison, it was more to showing that the hero and villains never rank that far away from each other.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]

Since people are posting their brackets, here's mine with Link and Cloud in the same division

Death Mountain Division-Hyrule was used last year, I don't any other good names
1)Link
16)Princess Peach

8)Vivi
9)Tails

4)Auron
13)Strider Hiryu

5)Tidus- I want to see Tidus Auron
12)Ghaleon

6)Vincent-both characters strentgh are unknown
11)Carl Johnson

3)Magus
14)Serge

7)Tommy Vercetti
10)Revolver Ocelot

2)Cloud
15)Gordon Freeman

Planet Zebes Division-Maybe Brinstar is a better name
1)Samus
16)CATS
interesting fact i noticed, the champion the past 2 years have faced CATS in the first round(Cloud 03, Link 04)

8)Kefka
9)Fox McCloud

4)Frog
13)Geno

5)Ryu
12)HK-47

6)Bowser
11)Morrigan Aensland

3)Ganondorf
14)Lyn(FE7)

7)Kirby
10)Ridley

2)Solid Snake
15)Ken Masters

Badass Character Division-Dante, Duke, Liquid, Sephy, Mewtwo, Zero,Protoman,Sub-Zero & Alucard,etc=badass!
1)Sephiroth
16)Duke Nukem

8)Yoshi
9)Viewtiful Joe

4)Liquid Snake
13)Vyse

5)Squall Leonhart
12)Protoman

6)Dante
11)Mewtwo

3)Zero
14)Jak

7)Alucard
10)Sub-Zero

2)Crono
15)Lloyd

Old School Division
1)Megaman
16)Crash Bandicoot

8)Luigi
9)Ryu Hayabusa

4)Master Chief
13)Mid-Boss

5)Sora
12)Ness

6)Zelda
11)Kerrigan

3)Sonic
14)Dr. Wily

7)Knuckles
10)Donkey Kong

2)Mario
15)Conker

---
Minnesota Vikings 2-1 (1-0 Div) North Division #1
Next Game: At Houston Texans 10/10

I'm too lazy to evaluate any more brackets.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Oh. Someone should include Ecco the Dolphin in their bracket.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Oh. Someone should include Ecco the Dolphin in their bracket.

He's in my snubs bracket, and he's decently well-known. But I think there are better choices before him.

Then again, it's not like Sega has a large number of entries...
---
It's David Bowie vs. Johnny Depp at www.rpgdl.com, with a side order of Omnislash!
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm > me.

Badass Character Division-Dante, Duke, Liquid, Sephy, Mewtwo, Zero,Protoman,Sub-Zero & Alucard,etc=badass!


You clearly forgot to mention Yoshi there.
---
Congratulations to nifboy, ps2rulezzz, and Hogasm, who won the guru challenge through their godly prediction abilities. : )

They are a mildly above average draw on days when they hit random fodder (i.e. anyone who isnt them), and a much bigger draw only when they run smack dab into each other. On top of that, you still cant definitivly say a lot of those votes arent just multis getting in on the action.

what?! WHAT?! have you gone insane?!

here are this year's Top Ten Highest Poll Totals:


Top 10 Most Popular Polls (by vote totals)

1) 124353 - (vi) Link vs. Cloud
2) 101451 - (v) Cloud vs. Samus
3) 96595 - (iii) Mario vs. Crono
4) 95122 - Tidus vs. Shadow the Hedgehog
5) 94535 - (v) Link vs. Megaman
6) 93661 - (iv) Link vs. Crono
7) 93558 - (iii) Link vs. Yoshi
8) 93546 - (ii) Squall vs. Kirby
9) 91390 - (iv) Cloud vs. Sephiroth
10) 91146 - (ii) Cloud vs. Vyse

i really felt the need to point out that seven of this year's ten most popular polls contained either Cloud or Link. they are easily the site's biggest draw.


I'm going for as many close, unpredictable matches as possible. If that means characters have to be over/underseeded, so be it. It makes for the best bracket.

What's more exciting, a close, competitive four pack (like the one I bolded), or one that's just going to come down to the 4/5? There's a much greater opportunity to lose points in a competitive 4 pack, and there's closer, more exciting matches. I can't imagine what's wrong with it. Tidus and Shadow deserve 7's, true, but what's the fun of seeing them blow out a 10 and then bow out to the 2?

exactly, RPGuy. that's been my philosophy as well. screwing the seedings makes for more interesting matches. plus, giving strong characters lower seedings messes with the casual bracket-makers' minds.

btw- RPGuy, your latest bracket is an excellent example of a great, unpredictable bracket. i like it much more than any others so far. i almost like it more than my version. almost. ^_^

and *gasp* - it has both Cloud and Link.

---
That's it. I have reached my threshold of pain. I am going home and I am going to play Megaman, eat snack cakes, and do my woman.

i like it much more than any others so far

V_V

I agree though. His is excellent.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

It is a great bracket. Let us hope that they dont' retire Clink.
---
Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

Well here's my adjusted rankings version 1. I only did the obvious SFF matches, but haven't gotten to 20XX, but here it is.

SFF 2004 Rankings

1. Link - 50.00%
2. Cloud - 48.18%
3. Sephiroth - 42.40%
4. Samus - 39.50%
5. Crono - 37.18%
6. Mario - 34.77%
7. Sonic - 33.56%
8. Magus 32.58%
9. Mega Man - 32.39%
10. Ganondorf - 32.39%
11. Auron - 30.57%
12. Ryu - 29.84%
13. Squall - 29.58%
14. Bowser - 28.88%
15. Zero - 28.50%
16. Alucard - 27.75%
17. Solid Snake - 27.73%
18. Vivi - 27.13%
19. Sora - 26.98%
20. Frog - 26.96%
21. Master Chief - 26.96%
22. Liquid Snake - 26.94%
23. Kirby - 26.61%
24. Dante - 25.49%
25. Yoshi - 25.22%
26. Donkey Kong - 23.62%
27. Luigi - 22.96%
28. Tidus - 22.82%
29. KOS-MOS - 22.60%
30. Shadow - 22.45%
31. Knuckles - 22.44%
32. Tommy Vercetti - 21.75%
33. Tails - 21.72%
34. Scorpion - 21.49%
35. Ness - 21.37%
36. Bomberman - 20.85%
37. Ryu Hayabusa - 20.66%
38. Jill - 20.64%
39. Viewtiful Joe - 19.63%
40. Jak - 19.20%
41. Duke - 19.09%
42. Kefka - 19.09%
43. Kain - 18.76%
44. HK-47 - 18.59%
45. Vyse - 17.91%
46. Max - 16.54%
47. Conker - 16.37%
48. Protoman - 16.12%
49. Crash - 15.79%
50. Sam - 15.03%
51. Pac-Man - 14.82%
52. Laharl - 14.25%
53. Lara - 13.91%
54. Gordon - 13.39%
55. Terry - 12.86%
56. Luca 12.35%
57. CATS - 12.17%
58. Ryo - 11.90%
59. Sly - 11.55%
60. JC Denton - 11.44%
61. Earthworm Jim - 11.03%
62. Ratchet - 10.06%
63. Guybrush - 9.82%
64. Tanner - 3.16%

Matches did:

Ganondorf vs. Alucard
Crono vs. Magus
Mario vs. Bowser
Sephiroth vs. Vivi
Link vs. Yoshi
Cloud vs. Squall
Sephiroth vs. Auron

Matches Need to do:

Zero vs. Protoman?
Mega Man vs. Tidus
Frog vs. Master Chief
Cloud vs. Sephiroth?
Link vs. Mega Man

Did I miss any of them?

---
Summer 2004 Contest 181/192
Congrates to Nifboy, the guru winner, who had to PWN me just to get there

Badass Character Division-Dante, Duke, Liquid, Sephy, Mewtwo, Zero,Protoman,Sub-Zero & Alucard,etc=badass!


You clearly forgot to mention Yoshi there.

If Viewtiful Joe isn't badass, I don't know what is.
And sorry, Tyranus, but I'm all bracketed out for tonight. I reconstructed mine and analyzed two others.

And thanks, cyko. I tried to make it as evil as I could.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Zero vs. Protoman?

Definitely.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Sephiroth and Samus would not be guaranteed to dominate if Clink were taken out. Common sense would say that FF7/Nintendo support would go to those two, but we simply don't know where the missing support will go. For all we know, all of Link's fans could rally behind Mario.
---
I am little more than a slug among the food chain that is Board 8, but perhaps if I were as cool as nifboy, that would not be the case. Congrats, nifboy! =)

Common sense would say that FF7/Nintendo support would go to those two, but we simply don't know where the missing support will go. For all we know, all of Link's fans could rally behind Mario.

But why wouldn't they rally behind Mario last year when he was up against Sephiroth? If there were ever a time for them to rally behind him, I'd say that was it....
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

If Link's fans went to Mario, he would have beaten Crono. It's far more likely that they just won't vote at all. Especially given a list of the most popular polls this contest. The casuals love Link and Cloud, and if they truly don't want them to return, they wouldn't vote them to victory.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

I'm just throwing a thought out there.
---
I am little more than a slug among the food chain that is Board 8, but perhaps if I were as cool as nifboy, that would not be the case. Congrats, nifboy! =)

LOL!!! check out this guy's bracket:

Bracket I made for SC2k5 (if there is one)
From: Dorami | Posted: 10/5/2004 11:18:37 PM | Message Detail
Upper Midgar Division

(1) Sephiroth VS (16) Ghaleon
(8) CATS VS (9) Guybrush Threepwood

(5) Ness VS (12) Vyse
(4) Ryo Hazuki VS (13) Gordon Freeman

(6) Mario VS (11) Donkey Kong
(3) Sonic the Hedgehog VS (14) Simon Belmont

(7) Crono VS (10) Serge
(2) Samus Aran VS (15) Mega Man

Lower Midgar Division
(1) Aeris Gainsborough VS (16) Lara Croft
(8) Fox McCloud VS (9) Miles "Tails" Prower

(5) Bowser VS (12) Luigi
(4) Shadow the Hedgehog VS (13) Bass

(6) Zelda VS (11) Alucard
(3) Frog VS (14) Sora

(7) Ryu Hayabusa VS (10) Viewtiful Joe
(2) Master Chief VS (15) Vic Viper

Foxhound Division
(1) Solid Snake VS (16) Terry Bogard
(8) Knuckles VS (9) Conker

(5) Dante VS (12) Strider Hiryu
(4) Liquid Snake VS (13) HK-47

(6) Tommy Vercetti VS (11) Jill Valentine
(3) Ryu VS (14) Crash Bandicoot

(7) KOS-MOS VS (10) Ken Masters
(2) Magus VS (15) Chun Li

22XX Division
(1) Zero VS (16) Bomberman
(8) Kirby VS (9) Duke Nukem

(5) Auron VS (12) Sam Fisher
(4) Tidus VS (13) Aya Brea

(6) Yoshi VS (11) Leon Kennedy
(3) Squall Leonhart VS (14) Max Payne

(7) Vivi VS (10) Kefka
(2) Ganondorf Dragmire VS (15) Raziel

see, this is a bracket without Cloud and Link. we get a bracket where we can see CATS win a match and see Ness vs. Gordon Freeman in Round Two! yippie! i also love how he put the remaining seven members of last year's Noble Nine in the same division with Megaman vs. Samus in Round One.

w.....t.....f......

---
That's it. I have reached my threshold of pain. I am going home and I am going to play Megaman, eat snack cakes, and do my woman.

For all we know, all of Link's fans could rally behind Mario.

I wish that would be so, but I severly doubt it.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

I'm just throwing a thought out there.

I know; all I'm saying is that I doubt that they would rally en masse behind another character. Believe me, I think it would be great if they did... I just don't really see it happening. =/
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

These are the types of people that want to get rid of Link and Cloud. If you think that bracket is even remotely unpredictable, shoot yourself.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Okay, I'm starting to get annoyed by the vast amount of brackets posted. Maybe we should devote a topic to everyone's brackets?

Or...in preparation for our Dream (real?) SC2K5 bracket, perhaps we should all combine and create one bracket? Or, maybe we could just choose one of the brackets already created and help make the adjustments.

I've been tempted to post my bracket a while ago, but I've refused to do so with so many people doing it...however, here's one 4-pack from the bracket I thought would be fun:

5)Lara Croft vs. 12) Morrigan Aensland
4)Kefka vs. 13) Strider Hiryu

Yeah, it's bad seeding and such, but it would funny to see how badly the brackets would crash and burn if Morrigan or Strider made it through. XP If that didn't happen, we'd probably see SPRITE KEFKA in Round 3!

No, those weren't the original seedings. I basically chose my roster, gave them all seedings (as I saw fit), randomly placed them in a division, and then adjusted the matches according to what would be interesting. As a result, I got that 4-pack above. :P

Perhaps this adjustment would work better:

6)Morrigan Aensland vs. 11)Lara Croft
3)Kefka vs. 14) Strider Hiryu
OR
5)Morrigan Aensland vs. 12) Lara Croft
4)Kefka vs. 13) Strider Hiryu

That's about as reasonable as I can get for thathe seeding, heh...at least Lara Croft only goes up 4 spots now.

---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think."

w.....t.....f......

It's Dorami. You know, Mr. "This contest has lost all credibility". Despite that, I think that bracket, while horrendously lopsided, does have its share of decent matches.
---
It's David Bowie vs. Johnny Depp at www.rpgdl.com, with a side order of Omnislash!
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm > me.

5)Squall Leonhart
12)Protoman

*cries*
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Comment about the poll -

Even though "Yes" is ahead right now, it is only about a 1600 vote difference. I know I'm biased about this, but if I wouldn't consider this a clear enough majority for taking them out.
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Ceej is smart enough to not do it if it's this close. I think...
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

6)Morrigan Aensland vs. 11)Lara Croft
3)Kefka vs. 14) Strider Hiryu
OR
5)Morrigan Aensland vs. 12) Lara Croft
4)Kefka vs. 13) Strider Hiryu

not bad, but Lara Croft has been reduced to fodder even against those guys. i think it would be even better if it was:

4) Viewtiful Joe vs. 13) Morrigan
5) Kefka vs. 12) Strider Hiryu

OR

4) Tommy Vercetti vs. 13) Morrigan
5) Kefka vs. 12) Strider Hiryu

---
That's it. I have reached my threshold of pain. I am going home and I am going to play Megaman, eat snack cakes, and do my woman.

Ceej is smart enough to not do it if it's this close. I think...

He has made some decisions recently that aren't that smart though...
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Good point, cyko. Thanks for that input. It would be funny, though, as Lara Croft might actually have been a favorite to win that.

Let's leave out Vercetti...he'd win the 4-pack for sure. Viewtiful Joe would be good, though.

---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think."

For all we know, all of Link's fans could rally behind Mario.

I don't know why they would suddenly change their minds just because Link is missing. It's not like they're all going to hold a meeting to decide who inherits his mass support.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

lol, I thought dorami's topics, though I only saw the title's were pretty funny, I always took it as a mock thing
---
Congratulations to nifboy, ps2rulezzz, and Hogasm, who won the guru challenge through their godly prediction abilities. : )

For all we know, all of Link's fans could rally behind Mario.

...I don't know why, but for a couple of seconds, I thought this seemed to be a possibility. But no, unfortunately, that will not happen...
---
Commander of The Link Army
Blades will bleed…Shields will shatter… and Link shall WIN!

Yes, but they got so old so fast. Then again, I'm not the type who's easily amused by people who abuse fads.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

*cries*

Your telling me. The better character always seems to have to lose...
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Why put Cloud and Link in the top division? Put them in the bottom instead, that way their match is closer to the end of the contest. Do something fun, like making Gordon Freeman a 1-seed for the top of the contest. Even more fun would be if there were some links to the GameSpy contest right before the bracket was released. Samus over Freeman being an upset would be absolutely priceless.
---
Although being raped by Sora twice was incredibly painful, nothing can compare to being utterly destroyed by nifboy in the Guru challenge.

Yeah, I know. Squall will never win this contest. It's extremely unfair.

However, I hate seeing a four-pack that has 3 out of my 10 favorite characters in it, with the possibility that the fourth character will win it.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Yes, but they got so old so fast. Then again, I'm not the type who's easily amused by people who abuse fads.

lol, yeah, like I said, I only read like, the last one, but it was still funny to see people take him seriously when I actually read one of the topics
---
Congratulations to nifboy, ps2rulezzz, and Hogasm, who won the guru challenge through their godly prediction abilities. : )

Squall will never win this contest.

Well actually, if you start removing characters from the Contest, eventually...Nah, forget it, Squall won't win...
---
Commander of The Link Army
Blades will bleed…Shields will shatter… and Link shall WIN!

I would rather Squall legitimately win this contest as opposed to him win by default because the rest of the characters who could beat him were removed.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Nothing like an honest victory.
---
Commander of The Link Army
Blades will bleed…Shields will shatter… and Link shall WIN!

Leonhart, just outta curiosity:

What did you think of Squall vs. Luigi? Did you predict Squall to win?

---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think."

You speak the truth.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

What did you think of Squall vs. Luigi? Did you predict Squall to win?

Best match ever. It brought tears of joy to my eye because I didn't think Squall could do it.

I had just started visiting the site at the beginning of the contest, so I had no idea how things worked here at GameFAQs. I figured Luigi would roll.

I always have a good time reading the old stat topics and seeing the reactions of everyone during the match. Classic.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Why put Cloud and Link in the top division? Put them in the bottom instead, that way their match is closer to the end of the contest.

Excellent idea, Mac.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

It doesn't really make a difference. And Ceej loves putting Link as the first match.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

It doesn't really make a difference.

Link/Cloud is one of the final four matches of the contest as opposed to one of the final seven matches. Pleases those people who complain how the rest of the contest is over after that point. We would only see three more matches after that instead of seven.
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

If seeding doesnt matter, why not just solve all our problems and have Link vs Cloud in the first round and have the rest of that division the battle of the weaker characters. Therefore, three divisions are still exicting from top to bottom.

Yeah, great idea Mac. Tis done on my bracket, at least.

Speaking of my bracket, I just predicted it to check for SFF (Only concern is Tidus/Sora right now). And it's even more evil than I though. I am happy.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

why not just solve all our problems and have Link vs Cloud in the first round

Because the contest is over right then and there.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]

I just wanna say that I love RPGuy's bracket the best. Filled with plenty of great characters/matches. Good job, man. =)
---
Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

Yes, nothing would be greater than seeing the contest decided with 62 matches left.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Leonhart, but whats the difference between that and having it in the Finals?

We just know which of the two characters wins earlier. Plus the rest of the bracket gets to be that much more balanced.

If seeding doesnt matter, why not just solve all our problems and have Link vs Cloud in the first round and have the rest of that division the battle of the weaker characters. Therefore, three divisions are still exicting from top to bottom.

You mean what Dorami did? It doesn't change enough to warrant the gross underseeding. Clink will smash everything else in the division, and the other side really won't be much different than normal (ie, 2/15 will still be a blowout). I only fudge seeding when I have a perfectly justifiable reason for it, that is, it creates a good first round match while still enabling a good second round match. That's what my Zelda, Aeris, Tidus, and Shadow four packs let me do: exciting first round matches followed by exciting second round matches. Changing Clink to a first round match does not allow for that, and there's at least something to be said for the hype leading up to the actual match. If it's held with 3 contest days to go, that's quite a difference from the first day.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

It immediately cuts the people who can win in half.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Because then the rest of Link's/Cloud's matches are extremely boring because we know that nobody will challenge them. Part of the fun is seeing how the two measure up to one another until they meet.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

I just wanna say that I love RPGuy's bracket the best. Filled with plenty of great characters/matches. Good job, man. =)

Thanks, HM. I tried to make as many matches as I could that CN's stats and mine would predict differently, too. Heh.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

I think my point was proven.

i want the strongest two characters, barring upset, meeting in the finals.

If it was first round, it would be essentially 63 points lost, instead of 32.
---
SC2K4 stats: 184/192 missed: Ganondorf, Tidus, Vyse, Sam, Zero, Squall
Rank: Tied at 163rd

i want the strongest two characters, barring upset, meeting in the finals.

That's what I want as well, but most people disapprove of the idea.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

(8) Kirby
(9) Tidus
OUCH, says I. Great 8/9

The extrapolated fanboy's nightmare. Tidus wins easily.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Well these people are looking at this contest from a bracket-makers point of view, while we are looking at it from an average voters PoV.

i want the strongest two characters, barring upset, meeting in the finals.

That's what I want as well, but most people disapprove of the idea.

If they have to meet in the finals, you have to sacrifice two Noble Nine members to them in the divisional finals. Isn't it better to let those two NN members go against each other? Sure, they'll get destroyed by Clink next round, but you have 2 good matches (Clink and Inter-NN) and on bad match (Clink vs NN) instead of 1 good (Clink) and 2 bad (Cloud vs NN and Link vs NN).
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Eh, there aren't really any inter-Noble Nine matchups that would really be up in the air. Put Sephiroth, Samus, and Crono in the same division, and put Mario, Sonic, and Mega Man in the other.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

(8) Kirby
(9) Tidus
OUCH, says I. Great 8/9

The extrapolated fanboy's nightmare. Tidus wins easily.

I'd certainly pick Tidus too, (as a matter of fact, that very match is in my bracket as a 4/13), but I don't think Tidus' collapse on Mega Man can be ignored. And I imagine there would be a lot of people biting on Kirby on that one.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

But think about my idea. If we have them meet in the first round and put the 14 weakest characters in that division two, we only sacrifice one top-32 character before the finals. Maximum save-age.

And I imagine there would be a lot of people biting on Kirby on that one.

Precisely why I have Tidus as the lower seed. The average bracketmakers will probably take the higher seed.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

but I don't think Tidus' collapse on Mega Man can be ignored.

And I think it can be perfectly explained. Tidus did the same against Sonic, which is why he rose instead of dropping like the rest of the West Division.

Speaking of which, where are all of the Mega Man supporters that tried to use "Tidus is one of the most consistent performers in this contest" as an argument that Zero wasn't the anomaly?
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Eh, there aren't really any inter-Noble Nine matchups that would really be up in the air. Put Sephiroth, Samus, and Crono in the same division, and put Mario, Sonic, and Mega Man in the other.

I beg to differ. I truly think Mega Man/Crono could go either way, and same with Mega Man/Mario. Mega Man's performances against Seph and Link were very, very different. I think he could perform up to par on Crono despite doing much worse against a common opponent. If Mario manages to revive some popularity through new DS launch games, he could go places as well. And Mario/Sonic is just begging to happen, especially with how close they are this year.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

I think we all set up Mario/Sonic right? I did put one obstacle in Sonic's way though.
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

And I think it can be perfectly explained. Tidus did the same against Sonic, which is why he rose instead of dropping like the rest of the West Division.

Or he rose because of KHF and the voter demographic change that heavily favored Square. I am no longer quick to say that Tidus is the 3rd strongest FF character (I'd give that honor to Squall, honestly), and I wouldn't call Tidus matches with Zero and Ryu the same way as I would have last year.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Eh, Crono wouldn't really be challenged by Mega Man. Neither he nor Mario appeared to change very much, while Crono obviously rose. Mario's and Mega Man's fanbases are very well-established as is. They'd need a game that revolutionizes the way people perceive them to change minds about them.

And if there's not Link-Mega Man SFF or whatever you decide to call it, then the Blue Bomber is on a lower level.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Or he rose because of KHF

Despite barely being in it at all, and bearing no resemblance to his FFX self other than his name? Then why in the world does he drop like a rock despite being in FFX-2 in a similar-sized role and being more prominently featured as a central figure?
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Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

I don't think Mega Man and Snake magically fell 6 and 8 points, respectively. I was against the idea of "SFF" in Link/Mega Man when it was first proposed, but I really can't deny it now. Mega Man does perfectly fine against Square characters (Sephiroth and Tidus come to mind), yet collapses against Nintendo characters. I could conceivably see him beating Crono yet losing to Mario, despite the fact that Crono would beat Mario.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

You forgot the "and the voter shift" part. Crono rose, and he was no where to be found in KH.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Why wouldn't Tidus go down in popularity.

What movie has Meg Ryan been in lately? Her star power has obviously diminished.

Sorry I had to.

I don't think Mega Man rose, while it's hard to deny that Crono did. It would be closer than his match with Mario, but he would still win.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

Missed all day... silly exams. Just perused it all, and the only comment I have was on Tidus/Kirby. My dream match. Tidus is way too low in the XSs this year, and most agree, but don't know what to do about it. The only thing we can do is make sure he gets a cushy match against one of those people a decent amount ahead of him. One of which is Kirby =)
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nifboy kicked ass and took names, including my own in SC2k4

If Ceej decides to go with the largest group and take out Link and Cloud so be it. That's well beyond our control, and it isn't as harmful as you'd think. Trust me, I spent enough effort arguing against the idea that I can see both sides quite well.

So taking out Cloud and Link doesn't change the predictability to us... it still changes it for the casual bracketmaker. It's almost like we're trying to handicap ourselves here. As it is, next year comes down to one question... will Zelda GC be out before the contest? If it is, Link all the way, if its not, Cloud all the way... basically. At least with Seph/Samus there's mystery. Seph is a good deal ahead, but doesn't stand to gain as much from AC as Cloud would, and a movie may do nothing at all for him. MP2, however, could be cause for a large leap forward. There is still the chance that removing Link and Cloud actually could make for a more interesting final matchup, and with us being two elites fewer we actually will have fewer unpredictable matches.

Yes, it would suck to have Link and Cloud gone, in many ways, but the biggest concern is vote totals. The problem with that is, if half the people don't want to see Link and Cloud again, and that ammount rises each year, then they will stop being worthwhile draws. They'd still get the biggest vote totals, sure, but their inclussion may lower the average vote total. Why drive away people who'd vote everytime just to get a whole crapload of people to vote once? If we lose 500 regular voters and have a finals that's 30,000 votes higher than average was the inclussion of those characters beneficial or harmful?

And really, think very carefully, what is the loss to YOU if Link and Cloud should be removed? What do you gain if they go? Go ahead, make a list, does one look better or do they look rather equal? On gut instinct I was quite against removing anybody, with time to think about it I can also see the benefits. Whether you are for or against it, you should really take the time to figure out why it would be bad and why it would be good. Until we've all looked at both sides it's hard to say for sure that one is ultimately correct and the other is not.
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I was gang-pwned by Link and his supporters in the guru contest. Congrats to nifboy, ps2rulezzz, and Hogasm.

You forgot the "and the voter shift"

I really doubt it helped Tidus. Final Fantasy X was at its peak in 2002. I don't think he would go up. I think he has nowhere to go but down since he's not a beloved character in the series (unlike Squall, who will be around forever), but I don't think Tidus just dropped off the face of the earth in the span of a year.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

"I am no longer quick to say that Tidus is the 3rd strongest FF character (I'd give that honor to Squall, honestly),"

I'd give it to Auron... I'd have had Auron over Tidus last year, as well, so I'd always have thought of Auron as #3 unless Vincent makes it in.
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I was gang-pwned by Link and his supporters in the guru contest. Congrats to nifboy, ps2rulezzz, and Hogasm.

I think he has nowhere to go but down since he's not a beloved character in the series (unlike Squall, who will be around forever)

With any luck, both will fall off the earth and be forgotten =)
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BtT: 3:48.46 | HRC: 51,246.1 ft OV aaaargh
I keep getting sig'd for the weirdest things lately - StW

both will fall off the earth and be forgotten =)

I'll make sure that never happens...I have a plan.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

I'll make sure that never happens...I have a plan.

Does it involve losing badly, living in self-denial, and having conversations with yourself in topics?
---
It's David Bowie vs. Johnny Depp at www.rpgdl.com, with a side order of Omnislash!
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm > me.

I'll erect a monument to Squall-existence!

And I don't talk to myself in topics. I only do that in real life.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

I'll make sure that never happens...I have a plan.

Just because Alucard's awesome is no reason to copy him >:O
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BtT: 3:48.46 | HRC: 51,246.1 ft OV aaaargh
I keep getting sig'd for the weirdest things lately - StW

My plan is infinitely superior to anything that Alucard could concoct. I'll make his plan look like something a mentally deficient chimpanzee developed.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

I'll make his plan look like something a mentally deficient chimpanzee developed.

So...Edouble?
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"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Basically.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

I figured that described him pretty well.
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"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

XD
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Ka-ching.
---
Question: Who owned some major ass in the Guru Prediction Contest?
Answer: Nifboy, fools...nifboy.

Ker-Thwap!!
---
I bow down to smitelf, Queen ***** of the Universe. Her intelligence, wit, and sexiness have consume’d me. Nifboy is an amazing, god-like diety.

Ooh, eee, ooh-ah-ah, ting, tang, walla-walla-bing-bang...

...let's quit while we're ahead. Well, not so far behind. Um...well, let's quit because we've already hit the bottom of the barrel?
---
Question: Who owned some major ass in the Guru Prediction Contest?
Answer: Nifboy, fools...nifboy.

My plan is infinitely superior to anything that Alucard could concoct. I'll make his plan look like something a mentally deficient chimpanzee developed.

!!!

how dare you insult alucard, bla bla bla, I know I'm going to love ffviii, and having just beaten six, I can get on with them, and I loved six, and that quote you used leonhart, and also, this must be a really stupid question, but where did alucard's plan originate from?
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Congratulations to nifboy, ps2rulezzz, and Hogasm, who won the guru challenge through their godly prediction abilities. : )

Sounds good to me. I need to make one of those mock bracket things one of these days, just for kicks.

*goes to look for a way to sneak Squall into the Elite Eight or Final Four*
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #17, 3-1
Next game: #3 Georgia Bulldogs (4-0)

I have always said, if I could do anything to save humanity. I go back and time and kill the man who thought up the idea of Squall thus saving us from apocalypse.

And not the Resiident Evil style with Zombies, the WWIII style with no one living.

A day or two ago, someone (I think it was Yesmar) posted a list of characters who increased or decreased. One of his ideas for why certain Nintendo characters might've increased is the poll placement helping those characters. I just have a question:

Why would the new poll position help Nintendo characters, but then we come to the conclusion that it hurt Nintendo characters in the Spring? That doesn't really make much sense to me.
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M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

I have always said, if I could do anything to save humanity. I go back and time and kill the man who thought up the idea of Squall thus saving us from apocalypse.

*points at Tetsuya Nomura*

He did it. ^.^
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M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

I dislike Nomura as much as the next guy, but I don't think you can blame Squall's character on him. Just the belts.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Amazing! I have the knowledge now! To SAVE THE WORLD!


...

Wait, I still need that time machine. Any suggestions?

Alas, RPG has brought cruel doubt in my choice and has brought my project to a halt. Need a new target to continue my holy crusade.

CRUSADE!

I dislike Nomura as much as the next guy, but I don't think you can blame Squall's character on him. Just the belts.

He also designed Tidus. Now mind you, I haven't played FFX, so I'll save the making fun of him until after I've seen him. But I'm sure that would make some of you hate him. ^_^
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M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

I thought Meg Ryan designed Tidus in her own image.

You know kind of like God and Men.

I think he also called Tidus one of his favorite designs. I don't have (that) much against Tidus, but his character design is typical Nomura awfulness. And this is saying nothing about Seymour, whose hair puts Cloud and Sephy's combined to shame.
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"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

On RPGuy's Bracket:

Link vs. Bomberman doesn't seem too great to me. In my eyes, 1 vs. 16 and 2 vs. 15 matches are perfect opportunities to include new characters. Why not throw Mai in instead of Bomberman? Or Ridley instead of HK-47? If we're going to have a blowout match, at least having it with a new character allows us to get some new insight.

Another problem, but one that's somewhat addressed by the first, is the lack of new characters. Not many of them are post SC2k3-release date characters. Only Lloyd, Kratos, VJ, and CJ. Of course, you can't predict what games are going to be big in the next year, but there have been some reasonably big ones in the last year. I can't really think of any right now, but I'm sure that some exist.

Third: very minor, but you have two ToS characters. I don't think this is really necessary for a game that's not likely to be very strong. At least take one out and put in a character from, say, Star Ocean 2 or Baten Kaitos.

Fourth: Felix might make an interesting addition, if you could fit him in somewhere, especially considering the possibility as him being as strong as it appeared in SC2k3.

And that's seriously every problem that I found with your bracket. It's godlike, definitely the best I've seen so far.
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Although being raped by Sora twice was incredibly painful, nothing can compare to being utterly destroyed by nifboy in the Guru challenge.

I think he also called Tidus one of his favorite designs. I don't have (that) much against Tidus, but his character design is typical Nomura awfulness. And this is saying nothing about Seymour, whose hair puts Cloud and Sephy's combined to shame.

He was asked by EGM who his favorite characters were (who he designed). He chose Tidus and Nanaki.
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M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Mac:

Crap, it's nearly 2. I have to go to bed. But first:

Bman is in because I included Ness and Joe, both of whom he outdid, and I felt bad for him. I'm open to fodder suggestions. And, uh, who's Mai? </ignorant>

I really couldn't think of many 2k3 released snubs, and I honestly don't know the names of SO3 or Baiten Katos characters. I suppose Claude or Dias from SO2 would be decent fodder. My fodder is, of course, very flexible, and I can sub in stuff as I find them to be strong.

Lloyd's in because I think he could do reasonably well. Similar to Felix. Kratos is in because he's ****ing awesome. But again, he's probably the 4th one out (after Vyse, HK, and Bman) if I see a snubbed character with good potential.

Felix would indeed be an interesting addition. I'll try to fit him in somewhere.

And I'm rather surprised I got no reaction from
(6) Master Chief 32.13
(11) Aeris Gainsborough 32.81
Especially given that MC is going to have Halo 2 next year. And Aeris will have a bit role in AC. The tables could turn in that match.

And thanks for the compliment. I think predicting it took me longer than making it, it was so difficult. ;)
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"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

RPG, try Kalas...

And, uh, who's Mai? </ignorant>

Mai Shiranui, from the Fatal Fury, King of Fighters, and Capcom vs. SNK/SNK vs. Capcom games.
---
It's David Bowie vs. Johnny Depp at www.rpgdl.com, with a side order of Omnislash!
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm > me.

"And, uh, who's Mai?"

Mai Shiranui is from many an SNK game. In fact, she's in almost as many as Terry. She has TJF like none other, and if anyone could actually get votes from it, it'd be her. She should have been in back during 2k2, instead of Iori, as she has always been one of the three most popular characters from SNK.
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I was gang-pwned by Link and his supporters in the guru contest. Congrats to nifboy, ps2rulezzz, and Hogasm.

Does someone have the poll id for the poll that just finished? It wasn't in the first 60 or 70 polls in the list...
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M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

it was a..ga ga ga GHOST POLL! ZOINKS!
---
Mario Sunshine-120 Shines || BtT 3:38.99 || HRC 37,592.3 ||

[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]

Does someone have the poll id for the poll that just finished? It wasn't in the first 60 or 70 polls in the list...

WHAOMG!! They skipped it! Just try 1781 and 1782... What's going on?
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I was pwned so badly by nifboy in the Guru contest, that I can't even tie my own boots -- Heck, I'm not even worthy of wearing them, after being pwned so badly.

Ceej must've realized it was a stupid idea... Yeah... That's it.

*crosses fingers and waves the "No" banner*

^_^
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M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Link vs. Bomberman doesn't seem too great to me. In my eyes, 1 vs. 16 and 2 vs. 15 matches are perfect opportunities to include new characters.

New joke characters, maybe. I don't see the point in letting a new character in if they have zero chance of winning. I'd prefer to have new characters in the 10-14 range, depending on their strength. For example, Vincent and Kerrigan would be capable of winning at least one match, but sticking them against Link and Cloud in round 1 would tell us nothing about their strength.

Or Ridley instead of HK-47?

Ridley should be in next year anyway. AFAIK, a Ridley appearance in Echoes has neither been confirmed or denied, but if he does show, an omission would be inexcusable.
---
Jon Thomson - nifboy > me
Nominate Ridley for Summer Contest 2005

Ridley would be interesting, to say the least.
---
Question: Who owned some major ass in the Guru Prediction Contest?
Answer: Nifboy, fools...nifboy.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/poll/index.html?poll=1596

Final results of yesterday's poll. Heh, it's about as split as they get. If there was any justice though, Tanner would be able to score a blowout on "Yes".
---
Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

Tanner. *chuckles*
---
Question: Who owned some major ass in the Guru Prediction Contest?
Answer: Nifboy, fools...nifboy.

I don't think Mega Man rose, while it's hard to deny that Crono did. It would be closer than his match with Mario, but he would still win.

If you take away from that Link match you see that Mega Man/Zero would be the only time he performed near his expectations against a character. He overshot his performance against Tidus by 10%, and then proceeded to beat Solid Snake by 4% more than he did last year. Earthworm Jim was untested, but he performed with a solid 83% there as well.

Now, I'm not saying it was SFF in Link/Mega Man but something happened during that match. Up to that point he was looking great, not at a championship, but just looking good in the overall "increase" of things. I think TRE had done something before the match started and got around a 2% increase for Mega Man, before he ran into Link. Nothing massive, but certainly believeable given what he had to increase through and his performances. Perhaps the craziest thing about all of this is how much Tidus/Solid Snake fall due to that performance.

RPGuy said, Mega Man/Crono is not a match that is one sided where "he'll never challenge Crono". That's just ridiculous. This year, Crono would win with 51.60% of the vote. When they are that close there's no way Crono would definitely have a victory in that match. That falls right along with the idea that Cloud would have won this year merely because he won by 51.60% against Link last year.
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Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

He should ask about specific characters... Like:

Would you mind if we banned Link from future contests?
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I was pwned so badly by nifboy in the Guru contest, that I can't even tie my own boots -- Heck, I'm not even worthy of wearing them, after being pwned so badly.

Let me clarify something. I am agreeing with RPGuy when he said it would a toss-up and am disagreeing with the statement that Crono would take it easily.
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Carolina Panthers (1-2)
Next game: @ Denver Broncos (3-1)

It's weird, but I think Mario has a better chance of beating Megaman than Crono does. Perhaps Mario and Megaman do have a similar fan base.
---
I was pwned so badly by nifboy in the Guru contest, that I can't even tie my own boots -- Heck, I'm not even worthy of wearing them, after being pwned so badly.

I still think Mega Man vs. Crono vs. Mario and maybe vs. Sonic would be close
---
Summer 2004 Contest 181/192
Congrates to Nifboy, the guru winner, who had to PWN me just to get there

If I were to make the bracket I'd go with a middle solution between fair seeding and interesting matches and it'd go like this:

(1) Link vs. (2) Sonic
(1) Sephiroth vs. (2) Samus
(1) Cloud vs. (2) Mario
(1) Megaman vs. (2) Crono

(And for kicks, if I was making the bracket, I'd name divisions after the Greek equivalent of the first letter of the top seeds' names.)
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Brother. Sister. Remote. Sex. Ninjas. By your powers combined, I am Captain Incest! -Stealth Snake Zero

Bman is in because I included Ness and Joe, both of whom he outdid, and I felt bad for him. I'm open to fodder suggestions. And, uh, who's Mai? </ignorant>

Well, Ness and Joe are both receiving new games in the next year, which should cause a substantial increase in popularity for them, especially Ness. I doubt that Bman is going to go up.

I really couldn't think of many 2k3 released snubs, and I honestly don't know the names of SO3 or Baiten Katos characters. I suppose Claude or Dias from SO2 would be decent fodder. My fodder is, of course, very flexible, and I can sub in stuff as I find them to be strong.


Yeah, I can't think of many 2k3 related snubs, but I'm sure there out there. And I'm also sure that there's some decent fodder, such as MewTwo and Ridley. MP2 is coming out, and I think MewTwo would do quite decently, especially considering SSBM. I certainly doubt that they would be weaker than Ghaleon.

As for Lloyd and Kratos, if you're going to have both of them in, at least put them in different divisions. Their matches are very close together, and I think it's more interesting when they're spread out.

And yeah, try Kalas. I think he's the hero from Baten Kaitos, which should be a successful GCN RPG. As I said, I don't really know many characters who would be good, but I'm sure it would be easy enough to find out, and I'd do so myself if I didn't have to go to school right away.
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Although being raped by Sora twice was incredibly painful, nothing can compare to being utterly destroyed by nifboy in the Guru challenge.

Well last year after the contest I made a topic that was called 2004 Nomination and people nominated there characters here's what they did

also the scoring went like this

1st - 4 Points
2nd - 3 Points
3rd - 2 Points
4th - 1 Point

Geno (Mario RPG) 19
Kain (FF2) 18
Mega Man (Mega Man series) 15
Ridley (Metroid) 13
Zero (Mega Man X) 12
Mewtwo (Pokemon series) 12
Sonic (Sonic series) 12
Kefka (FF3/6) 12
Link (Lengend of Zelda) 11
Crono (Chrono Trigger) 11
Frog (Chrono Trigger) 11
Mario (Mario series) 10
Yoshi (Mario series) 10
Magus (Chorno Trigger) 10
Pac-Man (Arcade) 10
Soild Snake (Metal Gear) 9
Lu Bu (Dynasty Warriors) 9
Bass (Mega Man) 9
Squall (FF 8) 8
Cloud (FF 7) 8
Luca Blight (Suikoden 2) 8
Bowser (Mario series) 7
Protoman (Mega Man Series) 7
Alex (Lunar SSSC) 6
Ark (Terranigma) 6
Mustadio Bunanza (FFT) 6
Ryu (Street Fighter) 6
Cassandra (Soul Caiabur) 6
Ashton (Star Ocean 2) 5
Diablo (Diablo) 5
Tir McDohl (Suikoden) 5
Scorpion (Mortal Kombat) 5
Kirby (Kirby series) 4
Goro (Shenmue) 4
Schala (Chrono Trigger) 4
Billy Hactcher (Sonic series) 4
Conker (Conkers bad fur day) 4
Ghaleon (Lunar SSSC) 4
Lan Hikari (Mega Man) 4
Ukyo Tachibana (Samurai Spirits/Samurai Shodown) 4
Ganondorf (Lengend of Zelda) 4
Dante (DEvil May Cry) 4
Cyborg Ninja (Metal Gear) 4
Yukishiro Enishi (Kenshin) 4
Sub-Zero(Mortal Kombat Series) 4
Morrigan (Darkstalkers) 4
Id (Xenogears) 4
Terry (Dragon Quest 6) 4
Hanzo (Samurai) 4
Brett (NFL) 4
Seifer (FF 8) 3
Clive (Suikoden) 3
Vivi (FF9) 3
Dizzy (Guilty Gear X2) 3
Terra Branford (FF 3/6) 3
Left Pong Paddle (Arcade) 3
The Alimighty Poo (Conkers bad fur day) 3
Axl (Mega Man X7) 3
Tails (Sonic Series) 3
Aya Brea (Parisite Eve) 3
Ryu (Breath of Fire) 3
Goemon (Mystical Ninja) 3
Gunrock (Powerstone) 3
Leisur Suit Larry (Leisur Suit Larry) 3
Dig Dug (Dig Dug) 3
Gex (Gex) 2
Cless (Tales of Phantasia) 2
Xiahou Dun (Dynasty Warriors) 2
Fina (Skies of Arcadia) 2
Right Pong Paddle (Arcade) 2
Frogger (Frogger) 2
Hiro (Lunar 2) 2
Zelda (Legend of Zelda) 2
Enzan (Unkown) 2
Simon Belmont (Castlevania) 2
John Madden (Unkown) 2
Nightmare (Soul Calibur) 2
Destin (Orge Battle 64) 2
Cid Highwind (Unkown) 2
Knuckles(Sonic Series) 2
Ryu Hayabusa (Ninja Gaiden) 2
GTA3 Guy (GTA3) 2
Pious Augustus (Eternal Darkness) 2
red XIII (ff VII) 2
Tommy Vercetti (Grand Theft Auto: Vice City) 2
Marco (Metal Slug) 2
Locke (FF 3/6) 2
Luna (Lunar SSSC) 2
Mai Shiranui (Fatal Fury and King of Fighters) 2
Arc (Arc the Lad) 2
Ms. Pac-Man (Arcade) 2
Alis (Phantasy Start 1) 2
Avatar (Ultima series) 1
Pikachu (Pokemon series) 1
Sarah (Shining Force 2) 1
Kung Fu Bunny (Brutal) 1
The Rock (wwe) 1
Laharl (Disgaea) 1
Chop Chop Master Onion (Parappa the Rapper) 1
Paddle Ball (Arcade) 1
Ken (Zoe 2) 1
Baal (Diablo 2) 1
Andy(Advance wars) 1
Mitsurugi (Unkown) 1
Kasumi (Suikoden) 1
San Shang Xiand (Dynasty Warriors) 1
Illidan (WarCraft III) 1
Big Boss (Metal Gear Soild) 1
Gospel (MM:BN2) 1
Tidus (FF 10) 1
Sol Badguy (GGX) 1
Jr. Pac-Man (Arcade) 1
Ritz (FFTA) 1
Commander Keen (Keen series) 1

---
Summer 2004 Contest 181/192
Congrates to Nifboy, the guru winner, who had to PWN me just to get there

Another day, and the stats live on! :)
---
I may be an Elite, a Guru, an Expert even..but even I pale in worthiness to the one called nifboy this contest...

Heroic Mario said something last night that got me thinking. I don't feel like searching for it now, but it was something to the effect that "Sigma is the villain of the MMX series, after all. We didin't think Liquid Snake could do anything either."

So I looked through my bracket for weak 3/4/5/6 seeds that didn't already have Tidus/Shadow/Aeris/Zelda/Vincent under them. And I saw a possible Tidus/Sora SFF match, shuddered, then had an idea. I think you can see where this is going.

But RPGuy, you say, Sigma can't possibly take on Sora! Sora's not the weakling we thought he was! That's what I thought, too, until I noticed this:

Sephiroth would get 44%+ on Cloud.
Ganondorf would get 31.62% on Link.
Magus would get 42.78% on Crono.
Liquid Snake would get 48.55% on Solid Snake.
Bowser would get 40.57% on Mario

Sora would get 38.38% on Mega Man.

The only villain that's further away from his hero than Sora is from Mega Man is Ganondorf, and we know his fanbase is almost entirely leeched off of Link, as he has no personality of his own. Sigma doesn't have that problem. Can you really say for sure that Sigma is too far away from Mega Man to win a match against Sora?

(4) Kirby 28.54
(13) Tidus 27.19
(5) Sora 29.62
(12) Sigma

Upset potential? You bet.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Wow.. The stats topic are still going fast after the contest is over.. Kudos to everyone who participates in the stats discussion.. =)

---
Congratulation to Nifboy who pwned all the gurus, including me in the Summer Contest.

Ganondorf, and we know his fanbase is almost entirely leeched off of Link, as he has no personality of his own.

I think Moltar would like a word with you. =P
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Hey, I love Gdorf, too. But doing worse than CATS against a common opponent, when that opponent happens to be your nemesis, shouts out "Leech!" to me.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Hey, I love Gdorf, too. But doing worse than CATS against a common opponent, when that opponent happens to be your nemesis, shouts out "Leech!" to me.

Yes, I know. Pretty impressive what completely leeching off Link can do for you against other opponent's though. =)

---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Why the hell did I use an apostrophe in "opponents" in my previous post? O.o;

---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

I also did something like that, char! Here are the top people:

Kerrigan - 36
Vivi - 26
Protoman - 23
Toad - 20
Falco - 18
Frog - 18
Chun-Li - 16
Mewtwo - 14
Rikku - 12
Geno - 12
Sub-Zero - 12
Captain Falcon - 11
Roll - 10
Ryu Hayabusa - 9
Viewtiful Joe - 9
Navi - 9
Ramirez - 9
Luca Blight - 9
Mallow - 8
Cecil Harvey - 8
Ridley - 8
Illidan - 7
Tifa - 7
Manny Calavera - 6
Axl - 6
Axem Rangers - 6

Note that not one Nintendo or Square char in the list made it. Damn company limits...
---
If life gives you lemons... just say thanks and read them! (^^)
Clair - WINNER of the 'Save my Pokemon girl!' Tournament

Oh wait... Vivi and Frog are Square! *smacks head on wall*

Still, it would be awfully nice to see Mewtwo or Geno in there...
---
If life gives you lemons... just say thanks and read them! (^^)
Clair - WINNER of the 'Save my Pokemon girl!' Tournament

Kerrigan - 36

Wow. Are we allowed to nominate with our alts? I have 7 alts, and if I'm allowed to use them to nominate, I will. =)
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Some interesting facts about my slightly changed bracket (which I don't feel the need to repost):

Characters not in the 2k4 contest: 26
Square Characters: 16
Nintendo Characters: 16
Capcom Characters: 12
Sega Characters: 5
Konami Characters: 4

Mai, Ridley, Kalas, MewTwo, and Felix are all in now, which is a change from the posted version.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

I'm trying to find out if Mega Man increased of not, but so far I have nothing or very little (except for Mega Man vs. Tidus theory, but I'm not sure about that)
---
Summer 2004 Contest 181/192
Congrates to Nifboy, the guru winner, who had to PWN me just to get there

Seriously in those 16 slots if we put weak characters there, might as well make them FUNNY.

Angry Sun, Tingle, Ultros, and Magikarp would be some good examples.

So, is there agreement among us that in case Mewtwo makes it into the next contest, he will do better than Pikachu?
---
If life gives you lemons... just say thanks and read them! (^^)
Clair - WINNER of the 'Save my Pokemon girl!' Tournament

Eh, I think he could do better, and Pikachu wouldn't be that bad of a 16-seed.
---
Although being raped by Sora twice was incredibly painful, nothing can compare to being utterly destroyed by nifboy in the Guru challenge.

Are you guys seriously thinking that MM increased?

Sure, something weird might have happened in his match against Link, but it's still a bad performance nevertheless.

Before you consider MM increasing a possibility, remember that this "weird" factor would increase as well.

Doing 4% better against Snake might look awesome, but when you look at Snake's track record in this contest, that's nothing to boast at all.

---
<In the process of looking for a new sig.>

After much deliberation, I have a mock bracket:

Division Magus A

(1)Magus
(16)Magus
(8)Magus
(9)Magus
(5)Magus
(12)Magus
(4)Magus
(13)Magus
(6)Magus
(11)Magus
(3)Magus
(14)Magus
(7)Magus
(10)Magus
(2)Magus
(15)Magus

Division Magus B

(1)Magus
(16)Magus
(8)Magus
(9)Magus
(5)Magus
(12)Magus
(4)Magus
(13)Magus
(6)Magus
(11)Magus
(3)Magus
(14)Magus
(7)Magus
(10)Magus
(2)Magus
(15)Magus

Division Magus C

(1)Magus
(16)Magus
(8)Magus
(9)Magus
(5)Magus
(12)Magus
(4)Magus
(13)Magus
(6)Magus
(11)Magus
(3)Magus
(14)Magus
(7)Magus
(10)Magus
(2)Magus
(15)Magus

Division Magus D

(1)Magus
(16)Magus
(8)Magus
(9)Magus
(5)Magus
(12)Magus
(4)Magus
(13)Magus
(6)Magus
(11)Magus
(3)Magus
(14)Magus
(7)Magus
(10)Magus
(2)Magus
(15)Magus

As you can see, I feel only one character deserves to ever be in this contest. Magus will suffer some severe Chrono Trigger SFF in some of his matches, but he clearly has a free pass into the finals.
---
I am little more than a slug among the food chain that is Board 8, but perhaps if I were as cool as nifboy, that would not be the case. Congrats, nifboy! =)

Ulti, you left out the obvious snubs of Janus, Alfador, Schala, and Queen Zeal.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Why do I take Ulti as a person who lost to Magus repeatedly just to see him win.

I still think Fou-Lu from BoF IV should be in the contest...
---
Commander of The Link Army
Blades will bleed…Shields will shatter… and Link shall WIN!

If there was some rallying behind Fou-lu come nomination time I'd be willing to support him. Of course, I'm hoping more for Ghaleon than pretty much anyone else at this point.
---
I was gang-pwned by Link and his supporters in the guru contest. Congrats to nifboy, ps2rulezzz, and Hogasm.

If MaGuS wInS i'Ll LeAvE gAmEfAqS 4eVaRrRrR!11!!!!!!
---
Question: Who owned some major ass in the Guru Prediction Contest?
Answer: Nifboy, fools...nifboy.

From: RPGuy96 | Posted: 10/6/2004 11:44:16 AM | Message Detail
Ulti, you left out the obvious snubs of Janus, Alfador, Schala, and Queen Zeal.

With the sole exception of Alfador, all of those characters are but mere fleas.

But since Alfador is the Entity, I'll give some thought into making him the 16th seed in Magus Division D.
---
I am little more than a slug among the food chain that is Board 8, but perhaps if I were as cool as nifboy, that would not be the case. Congrats, nifboy! =)

Janus has his moments. And Queen Zeal gets Magus battle music when you fight her, so some of Magus' awesomeness rubs off on her.
---
Red Star, Fall! Stain the earth red! Darkness falls, to usher in the end. Neverending fear will overcome this land. Destruction draws near, all by Lavos' hand!

"so some of Magus' awesomeness rubs off on her."

Considering the way some people talk of Magus, we need not think about him rubbing off on anyone.
---
I was gang-pwned by Link and his supporters in the guru contest. Congrats to nifboy, ps2rulezzz, and Hogasm.

If there was some rallying behind Fou-lu come nomination time I'd be willing to support him. Of course, I'm hoping more for Ghaleon than pretty much anyone else at this point.

I actually have promised to nominate Ghaleon and Totakeke. By the way, I saw you on RPGDL, Chichiri. ^_^
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

So, is there agreement among us that in case Mewtwo makes it into the next contest, he will do better than Pikachu?

Hell no. I couldn't ever imagine Mewtwo coming close to making the bracket, let alone coming close to winning a match against anyone other than CATS or Gordon Freeman.
---
Jon Thomson - nifboy > me
Nominate Ridley for Summer Contest 2005

Did you? What's your SN over there? Most everyone has the same, but since I haven't seen you I'm not sure if yours is or not.
---
I was gang-pwned by Link and his supporters in the guru contest. Congrats to nifboy, ps2rulezzz, and Hogasm.

So, is there agreement among us that in case Mewtwo makes it into the next contest, he will do better than Pikachu?

Obviously, there isn't agreement to his strength. I think it's almost impossible for him to do worse than Pika, though winning a match might be too much for him. Still, he could put down very decent numbers against some good opposition, and possibly even hit 40% against the likes of Sonic or Snake.
---
It's David Bowie vs. Johnny Depp at www.rpgdl.com, with a side order of Omnislash!
nifboy, ps2rulezz, and Hogasm > me.

My bracket has MewTwo up against Auron. It's a match he can't win, but he makes decent fodder, so why not stick him in?
---
Red Star, Fall! Stain the earth red! Darkness falls, to usher in the end. Neverending fear will overcome this land. Destruction draws near, all by Lavos' hand!

If Mewtwo's on the level of Knuckles, I'll eat my shoe.
---
Question: Who owned some major ass in the Guru Prediction Contest?
Answer: Nifboy, fools...nifboy.

Did you? What's your SN over there? Most everyone has the same, but since I haven't seen you I'm not sure if yours is or not.

The same. I only signed up a few days ago, and I've been talking to metroid composite about suggesting a character - you know Ozma from FFIX? I figured Ozma might be overpowered, but we've been talking and he might be workable, depending on what version you use.

I just posted for the first time about ... 30 seconds ago. Heh. So I doubt you would've noticed. ;)

---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

(And for kicks, if I was making the bracket, I'd name divisions after the Greek equivalent of the first letter of the top seeds' names.)

Aw heck yeah.

I want to see the Alpha face off against the Omega.

<_<


And just to make it even more confusing, have Sigma be the #1 seed in the Theta division.



---
"I AM THE BLACK MAGE! I CASTS THE MAGIC SPELLS THAT MAKES THE PEOPLES FALL DOWN!" RPGE777:ChocoCid

If Mewtwo's on the level of Knuckles, I'll eat my shoe.

You mean like AA - FFX style eating of your shoe? ^_~
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Fair enough, yes, I would, heh.
---
Question: Who owned some major ass in the Guru Prediction Contest?
Answer: Nifboy, fools...nifboy.

Well, you know, Pikachu was potentially on the raw end of two SFF matches last year. It's fairly possible that he's seriously underrated, and I could see him pulling 17-18% on Link without SFF if there was SFF previously. I can't see MewTwo being much stronger than that, but I could see him in the low 20's.
---
I was gang-pwned by Link and his supporters in the guru contest. Congrats to nifboy, ps2rulezzz, and Hogasm.

In 2k2, the little yellow rat's XS value was 15.32%. To be fair, he was stuck behind Cloud, so that should probably be higher. In 2k3, of course, he got double SFF'd by Link and Fox.
---
Red Star, Fall! Stain the earth red! Darkness falls, to usher in the end. Neverending fear will overcome this land. Destruction draws near, all by Lavos' hand!

Ozma sounds like he could be ranked Godlike. they certainly do need more Godlike characters, since it seems that many people want to downgrade a lot of the godlikes they don't think are godlike and there are only 92 of them as is. If they can enter only what, once evey four seasons, then everybody is bound to get bored of seeing the same guys over and over again.
---
I was gang-pwned by Link and his supporters in the guru contest. Congrats to nifboy, ps2rulezzz, and Hogasm.

In 2k2, the little yellow rat's XS value was 15.32%. To be fair, he was stuck behind Cloud, so that should probably be higher. In 2k3, of course, he got double SFF'd by Link and Fox.

And in 2002, wouldn't Pikachu have suffered because of Cloud's loss to Mario and Mario's subesquent bombing against Link?
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Ozma sounds like he could be ranked Godlike. they certainly do need more Godlike characters, since it seems that many people want to downgrade a lot of the godlikes they don't think are godlike and there are only 92 of them as is. If they can enter only what, once evey four seasons, then everybody is bound to get bored of seeing the same guys over and over again.

You read it? metroid composite said that Necron is sometimes considered one of the overpowered Godlikes. Ozma is actually significantly stronger - better defense, HP, and healing, can triple turn you with ease, immune to all normal attacks, can heal and attack on the same turn, etc.

I actually am trying to keep him toned down. ^_^;
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

And in 2002, wouldn't Pikachu have suffered because of Cloud's loss to Mario and Mario's subesquent bombing against Link?

That's what the "that should probably be higher" was for. ^_~

Still, I'm with Harrich. If MewTwo (badass pokemon?) is on the same level as Knux, I'll AA-eat my shoe.
---
Red Star, Fall! Stain the earth red! Darkness falls, to usher in the end. Neverending fear will overcome this land. Destruction draws near, all by Lavos' hand!

That's what the "that should probably be higher" was for. ^_~

Still, I'm with Harrich. If MewTwo (badass pokemon?) is on the same level as Knux, I'll AA-eat my shoe.

I figured - I just wanted to make sure that I understood your reasoning. ^_^;

---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Yeah, I read it. Been readin a lot over there.

And yea, Pikachu is probably underrated by a great deal. He might be an 11-13 seed, legitimately.
---
I was gang-pwned by Link and his supporters in the guru contest. Congrats to nifboy, ps2rulezzz, and Hogasm.

I'm of the opinion that Pikachu will always do worse than expected; if you cannot beat PaRappa any worse than 54-46, then there's something going against you pretty heavily. Also, durning the Pokemon/Xenogears match, the match was somewhat-close when it was just restricted to board-users...but when it got restarted and was open to everybody again, Pokemon did worse quicker; is that potentially a sign of anti-votes in effect? If so, it would be no surprise that Pikachu recieves it too, which would explain any possible reason why PaRappa could keep it close at all in 2k2.

Mewtwo wouldn't get half of the anti-votes Pikachu got, assuming they exist...but Mewtwo wouldn't get half the votes Pikachu got based on sheer name-value, either. Plus, if they were to face off, I would expect Pikachu to lay waste to Mewtwo.
---
Question: Who owned some major ass in the Guru Prediction Contest?
Answer: Nifboy, fools...nifboy.

I do wanna add that I would rather see Pikachu next year than Crash Bandicoot or Ryo Hazuki.
---
Question: Who owned some major ass in the Guru Prediction Contest?
Answer: Nifboy, fools...nifboy.

i'd like to SEE Sigma in this contest.

>_>
---
"I AM THE BLACK MAGE! I CASTS THE MAGIC SPELLS THAT MAKES THE PEOPLES FALL DOWN!" RPGE777:ChocoCid

I'd like to see Ramirez over Vyse. Anyone who's played Skies of Arcadia knows that Ramirez was much more of a badass than Vyse could ever hope to be. =)

And he says "Die" so cool. ^_^
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M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Vyse should NEVER come back..

when a match between you and a newbie is close... and you've historically done bad?

That's not a good sign. Vyse should NEVER be higher than 13 seed if he DOES come back. he's pure fodder.

Laharl should be no higher than 14, sadly.
---
"I AM THE BLACK MAGE! I CASTS THE MAGIC SPELLS THAT MAKES THE PEOPLES FALL DOWN!" RPGE777:ChocoCid

Ramirez is indeed far, far greater than Vyse. SoA's "voice acting" on a whole was pretty pathetic, but Ramirez' "Die." with absolutely no emotion (maybe some contempt, but no anger) was fantastic. As for Sigma, I think I showed this 4 pack earlier:

(4) Kirby
(13) Tidus
(5) Sora
(12) Sigma

I think he has a decent chance to win his match against Sora. And it would prevent Tidus/Sora SFF.
---
Red Star, Fall! Stain the earth red! Darkness falls, to usher in the end. Neverending fear will overcome this land. Destruction draws near, all by Lavos' hand!

His match with Laharl wasn't exactly close - ~ 14,000 vote difference.
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Ramirez is indeed far, far greater than Vyse. SoA's "voice acting" on a whole was pretty pathetic, but Ramirez' "Die." with absolutely no emotion (maybe some contempt, but no anger) was fantastic.

>=)

Ramirez was the only one who sounded cool when he used his attacks - unlike the others who sounded ridiculous. And he had the coolest attacks. And his sword kicked ass.

What about Ramirez doesn't kick ass?

Not as bad as the imposters though - I hated Vize's voice-acting. Good god...
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

I don't see how any video gamer would not know about Mewtwo. And I believe the Pokemon antivote doesn't apply to Pokemon in general; just Pikachu.
---
If life gives you lemons... just say thanks and read them! (^^)
Clair - WINNER of the 'Save my Pokemon girl!' Tournament

What about Ramirez doesn't kick ass?

He looks kinda like Raiden. Though, I suppose the original Skies came out before MGS2, so that's not even his fault. Other than that, Ramirez rocks.
---
Red Star, Fall! Stain the earth red! Darkness falls, to usher in the end. Neverending fear will overcome this land. Destruction draws near, all by Lavos' hand!

He looks kinda like Raiden. Though, I suppose the original Skies came out before MGS2, so that's not even his fault. Other than that, Ramirez rocks.

http://www.rpgdreamer.com/pics/skies/ramirez.jpg

I don't really think so...

But look at that sword... ^_^
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M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

ooh, sigma/sora...
awesome.
*bracketvotes sora*

>_>

Anyway, in keeping with CJayC's love of SFF:

2 Mega Man
15 Proto Man
8 sora
9 Sigma


Why do i get the feeling we'll see something similar next year?
*runs*

---
"I AM THE BLACK MAGE! I CASTS THE MAGIC SPELLS THAT MAKES THE PEOPLES FALL DOWN!" RPGE777:ChocoCid

Ceej has to have learned that his "cute" matches don't work out so well.
---
Red Star, Fall! Stain the earth red! Darkness falls, to usher in the end. Neverending fear will overcome this land. Destruction draws near, all by Lavos' hand!

I think the fact that two options in that poll he something about making it less predictable means that he understands that it was far too predictable this time around...
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

I think the 191 point brackets might have tipped him off, too.
---
Red Star, Fall! Stain the earth red! Darkness falls, to usher in the end. Neverending fear will overcome this land. Destruction draws near, all by Lavos' hand!

I freaking hope so.

Random brackets would be unpredictable...

But there'd be no seeding at all...
hm...

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"I AM THE BLACK MAGE! I CASTS THE MAGIC SPELLS THAT MAKES THE PEOPLES FALL DOWN!" RPGE777:ChocoCid

My bracket has fairly decent seeding, outside of Tidus/Shadow/Zelda/Aeris/Vincent, who are thrown in to make things interesting, and it's still damned hard to predict.
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Red Star, Fall! Stain the earth red! Darkness falls, to usher in the end. Neverending fear will overcome this land. Destruction draws near, all by Lavos' hand!

RPGuy, I am going to have some free time this weekend, and you had mentioned to let you know if I wanted your excel spreadsheet for the XS. If you could send it to tnote829@yahoo.com that would be awesome. Thanks a lot for your help. Once I hammer them out into a manner up to my standard (read: Tidus near Ganondorf and Magus), I will go ahead and create a nice little mock bracket with mass set-ups =)
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nifboy kicked ass and took names, including my own in SC2k4

Try a seriously ****ed up bracket:

(1) Link
(8)/(9) Match
(5) Squall
(4) Auron

(3) Tidus
(6) Liquid Snake
(7) Aeris
(2) Master Chief

~~~

(1) Mario
(8)/(9) match
(5) Sonic
(4) Ganondorf

(3) Crono
(6) Alucard
(7)/(10) match
(2) Mega Man

~~~

(1) Cloud
(8)/(9) match
(5) Sora
(4) Frog

(3) Zero
(6) Magus
(7) Vincent/(10) Knuckles
(2) Snake

~~~

(1) Sephiroth
(8)/(9) match
(5) Kefka/(12) Terra
(4) Viewtiful Joe

(3) Samus
(6) Kirby
(7)/(10) match
(2) Gordon Freeman
---
SpC2k4: 162/192 ~ SC2k4: 187/192
A tribute to Glenn's eternal victories.